[xMenace]

Livable Low Carb: Am I Missing Something???

http://www.cardiab.com/content/pdf/1475-2840-8-23.pdf



Abstract
Postprandial hyperglycemia is characterized by hyperglycemic spikes that induce endothelial
dysfunction, inflammatory reactions and oxidative stress, which may lead to progression of
atherosclerosis and occurrence of cardiovascular events. Emerging data indicate that postprandial
hyperglycemia or even impaired glucose tolerance may predispose to progression of
atherosclerosis and cardiovascular events. There is evidence that postprandial hyperglycemia, but
not fasting hyperglycemia, independently predicts the occurrence of cardiovascular events. We
proposed a concept of 'vascular failure' as a comprehensive syndrome of vascular dysfunction
extending from risk factors to advanced atherosclerotic disease. Postprandial hyperglycemia is
therefore one of the very important pathophysiological states contributing to vascular failure.
Accordingly, controlling postprandial hyperglycemia should be the focus of future clinical
investigation as a potential target for preventing vascular failure.

[Rekarb]

I get this. What I'm looking for now are numbers. How long the spike last above a certain level. That is what I'm not seeing and that is what is important to know.

I keep digging but all I'm getting is that glycemic excursions are bad and that they are more important to control than anything once the A1c gets below 6.

Heck, I know they're bad but I'm going to my endo tomorrow with my numbers and when I point out my spikes, he can just shrug because there is no data saying whether they are dangerous or how dangerous.

I'm below 6 and no one is going to sue him if he decides further treatment is unnecessary. So what if I come down with some vicious weird problem in 10 years. Now, if he decides to do some more intervention and I drop over suddenly, all eyes will look askance at him for pushing it when there was no danger he could point to.

Frustrating, very frustrating.

Mike

[foxl]

THANK YOU! I knew I had read this somewhere!

[MCS]

The surgeon that did my quad by pass a few weeks ago, said he could immediatle tell when he saw my coronary arteries that I had, had high BG levels. He said my arteries looked the same as everyone else that had high BG for an extened period of time.

From what I have read you can reduce the oxidative stress by taking Vitamin C, and Vitamin E.

I grew a new artery from the back of my heart to front of my heart by taking these two supps and exercising to my threshold daily.

Short point is I agree with the oxidative stress, I am living proof. Now as others have said, what are the numbers. I think they are different for all individuals. I was given Litpitor to alter my Cholesterol levels. Lipitor is a secondary component, doesn't eliminate the damage thats occuring to your blood vessels, it provides a means to keep your blood from building up plague on the damaged area. Best not to have the damage if possible.

[Rekarb]

Originally Posted by MCS

...
Short point is I agree with the oxidative stress, I am living proof. Now as others have said, what are the numbers. I think they are different for all individuals. I was given Litpitor to alter my Cholesterol levels. Lipitor is a secondary component, doesn't eliminate the damage thats occuring to your blood vessels, it provides a means to keep your blood from building up plague on the damaged area. Best not to have the damage if possible.

Of course, everyone is different but that hasn't stopped organizations from putting out info that sets out very specific limits to be observed. Here, we've got nothing. You might not have had the heart problem if you had knew anything about these numbers.

Mike

[Rekarb]

Originally Posted by foxl

THANK YOU! I knew I had read this somewhere!

Ok, you've got the info, think you can find these numbers? I might have found something by now but I keep getting blocked and can only get the abstracts.

Mike

[foxl]

Mike, there are no numbers, per se.

They use markers of inflammation, mostly, and do not mention "safe" limits for postprandial BGs, that I am able to find so far.

although I would guess THIS cit:

Ceriello A: The emerging role of post-prandial hyperglycemic
spikes in the pathogenesis of diabetic complications. Diabet
Med 1998, 15:188-193.

Might hold promise for some more quantitative info ....

[foxl]

"Quantifying acute variations
of glucose plasma level in diabetic patients is a
difficult task, so that at present insufficient data are
available to define precisely the role of hyperlgycaemic
spikes in the course of diabetes."


Apparently, darn it, the numbers themselves are elusive. That is a quote from the citation ... trying to backtrack through the lit ....