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View Poll Results: What is worst on your DP? | |
Total calories the day before?
|    | 8 | 19.05% | |
Total saturated fat the day before?
|    | 0 | 0% | |
Total fat the day before?
|    | 3 | 7.14% | |
Phase of the moon? or Mercury rising?
|    | 31 | 73.81% |
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06-26-2009, 09:52 AM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | | Dawn Phenom question ...
If you have DP, what makes it worse? Apart from eating (or NOT) a late-night snack of carb or carb plus protein, to quash it, that is ...
I am starting to suspect a couple things, in my case ...
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5% 
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA. |
06-26-2009, 10:04 AM
|  | Senior Member
I am a: Type 2 | | Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Sarasota (sort of) Florida
Posts: 1,157
| | | None of the above.
For me it's the carbs I've had at dinner the night before.
I'll test 2 hours after a dinner of say 35 carbs abd test at 100.
The next morning I'll be at close to 150.
Cut dinner carbs to 20 and I'll test in the morning at 120.
Art
__________________
My plan is to live forever.
So far, So good
|
06-26-2009, 10:08 AM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | | Art for me it seems unrelated to dinner carbs or net carbs over the day, even.
So odd ... biochemically it seems more to do with either fat or total calories consumed, not yet sure which.
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5%
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA. |
06-26-2009, 10:17 AM
|  | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1 | | Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 4,385
| | None of the above...
Lack of exercise or activity the previous day especially from the afternoon on, or,
Sometimes the day after a big day of activity, (ie, I get a time of subdued basal dynamics, then it's like a spring recoiling) has the biggest effect on exacerbating basal events or dynamics. I know I mentioned this is another related thread, not intending to beat a horse to death, I promise, it's just what I find.... 
__________________
−− Type 1 since 1991
≈≈ Minimed Paradigm 722 since 2007
~~ Metformin ER since Sep 2009 |
06-26-2009, 10:34 AM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Subby  None of the above...
Lack of exercise or activity the previous day especially from the afternoon on, or,
Sometimes the day after a big day of activity, (ie, I get a time of subdued basal dynamics, then it's like a spring recoiling) has the biggest effect on exacerbating basal events or dynamics. I know I mentioned this is another related thread, not intending to beat a horse to death, I promise, it's just what I find.... |
It's okay Subby -- I ALWAYS pay attention to your advice! And this is totally relevant! Thanks -- you are very good at attending to your body, I generally am, so I have a lot of respect for your thoughts, here.
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5%
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA. |
06-26-2009, 10:35 AM
| | Member
I am a: Type 2 | | Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Southern California
Posts: 459
| | | It's absolutely got to be the phase of the moon or mercury rising in my case. Nothing else that I've tried has had an impact!!!!!
Since switching to Levemir, I notice that my DP returned for a while and even after increasing my dose, I still rarely see morning fasting levels lower than 100. They're usually in the 100-108 range which I'm not thrilled about, but if I increase my Levemir dose any more, I run the risk of going too low later in the day.
__________________
Levemir, Novolog
Metformin 850 x 3
Lower carb lifestyle A1C:
11/3/07: 7.5
2/23/08: 7.4
8/30/08: 8.1  1/29/09: 5.7 5/21/09: 5.7 9/28/09: 5.8 Triglycerides:
11/3/07: 321
2/23/08: 328
8/30/08: 330 1/29/09: 166 5/29/09: 230
9/28/09: 201 |
06-26-2009, 10:42 AM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 2 | | Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Sarasota (sort of) Florida
Posts: 1,157
| | | You realize sometimes it's simply the Aliens!!!
Art
__________________
My plan is to live forever.
So far, So good
|
06-26-2009, 10:44 AM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by art You realize sometimes it's simply the Aliens!!!
Art |
Hence the astrology reference ... and considering a foil hat for bedtime!
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5%
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA. |
06-26-2009, 11:03 AM
|  | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1 | | Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New Brunswick Canada, eh
Posts: 8,646
| | | In my experience quality of sleep seems to affect it, but not consistently. If I have a long, deep night's sleep, I often wake up high. |
06-26-2009, 12:48 PM
|  | Ex-moderator
I am a: Type 1 | | Join Date: May 2003 Location: دولة الإمارات العربية المتحدة, دبيّ
Posts: 3,802
| | | I think we need to clarify exactly what we mean here by Dawn Phenomenon. You're making it sound like it's a reaction to low blood sugar during the night, which is a totally separate issue.
In my case, I find what caused me to go from a normal BG at 4am to an elevated BG by 8am was not eating a breakfast with carbs in it. My DP was a clear case of my body being 'used' to the idea of having no food whatsoever being put in it for about 12 hours, hence a liver dump since physiologically a non-diabetic would require that.
By eating a carby breakfast (yoghurt or a slice of toast), I retrained my body to expect a carb hit in the morning, which in turn led to my liver deciding it didn't need to provide me with one by itself.
So in other words, not eating carbs in the morning makes my DP worse. |
06-26-2009, 01:10 PM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by DeusXM I think we need to clarify exactly what we mean here by Dawn Phenomenon. You're making it sound like it's a reaction to low blood sugar during the night, which is a totally separate issue.
In my case, I find what caused me to go from a normal BG at 4am to an elevated BG by 8am was not eating a breakfast with carbs in it. My DP was a clear case of my body being 'used' to the idea of having no food whatsoever being put in it for about 12 hours, hence a liver dump since physiologically a non-diabetic would require that.
By eating a carby breakfast (yoghurt or a slice of toast), I retrained my body to expect a carb hit in the morning, which in turn led to my liver deciding it didn't need to provide me with one by itself.
So in other words, not eating carbs in the morning makes my DP worse. | Mine, too ... but I mean having a fasting morning reading of
> 110, say, being dependent on what you had consumed the day and evening before. I can always tell if I overindulged the afternoon or evening before ... and I think mostly in saturated fat, by that morning reading. It seems to have more influence than anything else about my diet, and maybe exercise too.
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5%
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA. |
06-26-2009, 06:35 PM
|  | Junior Member
I am a: Type 1 | | Join Date: May 2009 Location: South Africa
Posts: 13
| | | "Cortisol's rising" answer...
Having a bigger Brain, after covering it with inwardly reflecting foil. Its baby-bawling powers of persuasion are thus amply amplified at 4am,when BG is dwindling, to give Hypothalamus a much heftier nudge, who in turn is going to wring out Pituitary, leading to..."Cortisol's rising" from Adrenal Cortex.
And while "it" is shining, BG levels will rise (thanks to conversion of both glycogen & amino acids to glucose) to muffle Brain, whereas the mere presence of "it" will send nocturnal? Hypothalamus to sleep and bring above paragraph and this sentence to a grinding halt... until tomorrow morning.
Which is a long-winded way of saying that carbs, ingested early enough, should and does hamper the DP, but is it enhanced by fats?...fat (1 in a ?) chance!
My bet would always be on the 1/2 a wildebeest I had for supper. (Gnuconeogenesis, here I come!) |
06-26-2009, 07:37 PM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 1.5 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: KCMO
Posts: 5,100
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Ckoei "Cortisol's rising" answer...
Having a bigger Brain, after covering it with inwardly reflecting foil. Its baby-bawling powers of persuasion are thus amply amplified at 4am,when BG is dwindling, to give Hypothalamus a much heftier nudge, who in turn is going to wring out Pituitary, leading to..."Cortisol's rising" from Adrenal Cortex.
And while "it" is shining, BG levels will rise (thanks to conversion of both glycogen & amino acids to glucose) to muffle Brain, whereas the mere presence of "it" will send nocturnal? Hypothalamus to sleep and bring above paragraph and this sentence to a grinding halt... until tomorrow morning.
Which is a long-winded way of saying that carbs, ingested early enough, should and does hamper the DP, but is it enhanced by fats?...fat (1 in a ?) chance!
My bet would always be on the 1/2 a wildebeest I had for supper. (Gnuconeogenesis, here I come!) | Oh, MAN that is most excellent! I would love to see that diagrammed!
Wildebeest -- nom, nom, nom! But, what about those hyenas you had to fight off?
__________________
Linda Initial A1c Feb 6 09: 12%
Aug 24 A1c (MD office) 5.5%
Jul ... C-pep 1.3, GAD-65 > 30
metformin 1000 mg BID
Simvastatin 80 mg
Ramipril 5 mg
T4 125 mcg
baby aspirin
Vitamin D3, 2000 IU (blood values normal, advised to continue this dose by endo)
CoQ10 100 mg
Eating 70 - 90 g carb per day
Interval training on recumbent cycle
BMI is down to ca. 25.8 According to Joslin's Diabetes, 2005 ed., 5 - 30% of those diagnosed as Type 2 actually have LADA.
Last edited by foxl : 06-26-2009 at 07:38 PM.
Reason: typose as always
|
06-26-2009, 07:42 PM
| | Senior Member
I am a: Type 2 | | Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Vancouver Island B.C.
Posts: 552
| | | Ckoei,
I have to say this quickly although I'm SURE no one else would think of it. I thought I gnu you from somewhere. Linda, no new thoughts from me (what a surprise) but I'm perfectly willing to try the tinfoil hat.
__________________
Susan
DX Dec4/08 FBG 19(342)
Dec4 /08 A1C 10.9
Feb.4/09 A1C 7.6
may4 /09 A1C 5.2
Sept 4/09 A1C 5.4
Current meds: 21/2x 500g metformin, 5 mg ramipril, multivitamins, Ca, 500g alpha lipoic acid
Low carb- started at < 50 , now can handle 100
|
06-27-2009, 05:08 AM
| | Junior Member
I am a: Type 1 | | Join Date: May 2009 Location: South Africa
Posts: 13
| | | Sumi,you have just caused yourself to be declared a gnusance and me to insist that from now on, gnu should be pronounced in the proper Khoisan way.(Ask the oracle about "retroflex nasal click" and "nqu")
Linda, the hi-enas usually get the last laugh, especially if the lo-enas get to me first.
My 7AM BG values are rarely above 5(x18.25), and the presence of cortisol-induced insulin resistance only (sometimes) becomes manifest after ingestion of 60g of carbs (cereal,milk,banana).On the few times I have skipped breakfast, I have sailed on an even 5ish keel until lunch.
Does people who work night-shift experience a dusk phenomenon? |
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