walmart does it again ....even cheaper test strips

[confussedt2]

HI,I just bought 100 onetouch my insurance and i paid $132.00 for 100 test strips,these test strips were first issued i believe in
about 1980 if you can believe the internet,if so then you would think they should have gotten most if not all of their R&D back
by now.
Also if you were to extend these costs out to all of of the people that use the cost is enormous,if you test before and after each
meal that's at least 6 per day,times 365 days,times the millions of people that need to do this,then you compare this to WAL-MART
purchase price then how much we are being over charged.

[labrat]

I'm gonna purchase one of the Relion meters. My insurance only covers 2 to 3 strip usage per day. I received my first batch of 100 for the Accu-Chek Ultra that I
am using. I think my copay for the strips and the meter was 30 to 40 bux. I received a Bayer Contour in the office at my dx, but my insurance company doesn't
cover Bayer products. Geeze @ the amount I pay for my "choice" insurance as it is! Can't live with it, can't live without it.
The prescription is for testing twice a day. I asked my NP and physician about this, they said insurance will not increase the amount of strips if you're considered
"controlled." Therefor...out of pocket, here I come. I'm still new and experimenting, and I test 4 to 6 times a day. Some meals I know won't spike me. I certainly
feel I need to test more than 2x's a day!
I've read mixed reviews about the quality of Relion, and Consumer Reports gives it a Best Buy. I think its worth the price for those of us who have to reach
out of pocket more often for things like this. I'll let people know my findings when I begin using it. Oh and which one I buy.

[bigdad7]

not to hijack my own thread but being that they can sell them at 9 dollars and make a profit .....how much of the cost of strips on the shelves is marked up for insurance costs as i doubt anyone is running 9 dollar strips through their insurance so i am wondering if a large part of their savings is based on limited marketing and no need to pass costs of dealing with insurance on to us .....same as those walk in clinics for 25 or 40 that only take cash while a regular doc visit costs 70 to 100 just pondering

[labrat]

not to hijack my own thread but being that they can sell them at 9 dollars and make a profit .....how much of the cost of strips on the shelves is marked up for insurance costs as i doubt anyone is running 9 dollar strips through their insurance so i am wondering if a large part of their savings is based on limited marketing and no need to pass costs of dealing with insurance on to us .....same as those walk in clinics for 25 or 40 that only take cash while a regular doc visit costs 70 to 100 just pondering

I would say considerably marked up, and not necessarily insurance profit. I can only equivocate a bit to how list prices for laboratory testing are set at my place of
employment..a not-for-profit hospital. CMMS (Centers for Medicaid and Medicare) generally only reimburse about 1/4 to 1/3 of list price costs. They are
gradually reducing these rates, too. Many assays (and I can only speak for laboratory testing, not radiological, etc..but I assume a similar logistical/algorithm) cost a little to much more to cover the cost of performing the actual test vs that reimbursement rate. Insurance companies (private) usually have a contractual obligation with various hospitals, laboratories, out patient diagnostic facilities. There is variation between state requirements for insurance coverage, your level of coverage, etc. Many hospitals eat much of the costs differences for these CMMS reimbursements. Pushing some cost on the self-pays, increasing test costs. I perform a couple of tests by which a component is required by CAP and
other regulatory licensing agencies, but it's not reimbursed by CMMS at all. We eat those costs.
In the hospitals I've worked, financials have self-pays that let them establish a payment of 5% to 20% of the list price.
If you have private insurance..and depending on the insurance and your tier, you notice the contractual deductions on your Estimate of Benefits. Many times these
reflect 1/3, 1/4 or less of the actual "list price." Generally, our list price for services are 3.5 times the base cost of providing these services, just to recoup the 1/3 to 1/4 that we will receive from these agreements. Many insurances follow the CMMS protocol, and this will play even larger with the Health Care implementation.
We've been playing with increasing regulatory issues for a couple of years now, as if they weren't an enormous part of our job for decades anyway. I do digress...

So, right, wrong, appropriate, inappropriate, whichever it may be, I'm sure those companies (Roche, Bayer, Smith-Klein, etc) that produce home health
products are following a similar patterns knowing most will utilize their insurance (medicaid/medicare or private). Thus the increases in these medications and
devices. Patients are removed from the price point and negotiations, and physicians are moreso regulated by what insurances (and ultimately CMMS)
deem appropriate for treatment.
I'm not supporting the system, by any means, but I'm aware of some of the reasons for increases in healthcare costs. I don't think jumping off the cliff that we
seem to be doing will ultimately help.

Forgive the awkward breaks in my posting. On a silly netbook and it formats funny.

[pcramer1]

HI Sarah, Walmart carries testing supplies online--shipped to your home--try it??

[cyberus]

If they sell enough strips (and I think they will) they will quickly recover all technology expenses. The funny thing is all manufactors had this option. They were just to greedy to see that by reducing their price they would sell more therefore increasing their profits. I will will no longer have to skimp on testing at only $.18 per strip. These strips are are cost less than my co-pay on my regular strips.

I'm with you .. given the number of T2 nowadays they're betting on volume vs margin per unit

[Hammer]

Reading this thread, I can't help but think that what we are seeing is the typical, big corporation greed factor.....and it's not just in test strips. While we here are focused on anything diabetic, what the test strip companies are doing is no different than what most other companies are doing. Think about it.....what did you pay for a new car? If you did your homework, you might have gotten your new car for a low price.....let's say you got it for $100 over dealer invoice. Keep in mind that the dealer invoice is not what the dealer pays for the car, it's just an invoice.(there is something called a hold back and that's typically 3% of the sticker price of the car. This is what the manufacturer gives the dealer for selling the car....above whatever the dealer makes on selling the car to you.)

Okay, so you got the car for $100 over invoice...let's say that price was $23,000. The next customer who buys the same car might not have done their homework, so they might pay $24,500 for the exact same car. That customer was overcharged an additional $1500. How does this relate to test strips? Simple....what you pay for test strips isn't what the insurance companies pay for test strips. Like car dealers, if the car dealers get the cars for less, then why can't we get them for less. If the insurance companies can get the test strips for less, then why can't we get them for less?

[Tribbles]

Meters themselves are really all the same. The electronics is very basic for the meter function and you could build your own if you wanted to without much effort (it wouldn't be as small or pretty). The difference is in the manufacturing of the enzymes for the strips since that's biochemistry, although I think they all use the same enzyme now, so consistency and repeatability will always be an issue. Arkray are a reputable manufacture though.

[Vilya]

I use a ReliOn Confirm, and I find it to be very accurate. Last time I got bloodwork, I tested right before they drew, and the Confirm was 1 pt. off the lab results. For the Confirm, a box of 100 strips is $36. But if I can now get the Prime and get 100 strips for $18, I'm switching!

[labrat]

Reading this thread, I can't help but think that what we are seeing is the typical, big corporation greed factor.....and it's not just in test strips. While we here are focused on anything diabetic, what the test strip companies are doing is no different than what most other companies are doing. Think about it.....what did you pay for a new car? If you did your homework, you might have gotten your new car for a low price.....let's say you got it for $100 over dealer invoice. Keep in mind that the dealer invoice is not what the dealer pays for the car, it's just an invoice.(there is something called a hold back and that's typically 3% of the sticker price of the car. This is what the manufacturer gives the dealer for selling the car....above whatever the dealer makes on selling the car to you.)

Okay, so you got the car for $100 over invoice...let's say that price was $23,000. The next customer who buys the same car might not have done their homework, so they might pay $24,500 for the exact same car. That customer was overcharged an additional $1500. How does this relate to test strips? Simple....what you pay for test strips isn't what the insurance companies pay for test strips. Like car dealers, if the car dealers get the cars for less, then why can't we get them for less. If the insurance companies can get the test strips for less, then why can't we get them for less?

The only problem with this theory is that the insurance companies are not the purchasers of medical products. They themselves do not buy the test strips. They
are highly regulated by federal, state and local mandates. Insurance companies act , I'd say, as mediators with vendors and providers and their customers (patients)
in contractual agreements to provide services for a specific set price point. This varies greatly from state to state and locality. For instance, if you live in certain
states, and wish to purchase health insurance..then your policy MUST cover hair plugs. This is because, generally..some litigation at some point determined that
there must be a law requiring all health insurance in that state to cover hair plugs. Therefore, your premiums go up. Among other reasons.
It's the conglomerate of those participating in buying the coverage that makes the benefits of a whole advantageous (or not). So when you go to buy those
medications or glucose meter from the pharmacy..you are paying the agreed upon copay (or no copay, depending on your coverage) between your insurer and the
manufacturer they are obligated.
I'm not defending nor supporting, but the comparisons to other industries are not apt. It's a bit more convoluted, and complicated.

[labrat]

I use a ReliOn Confirm, and I find it to be very accurate. Last time I got bloodwork, I tested right before they drew, and the Confirm was 1 pt. off the lab results. For the Confirm, a box of 100 strips is $36. But if I can now get the Prime and get 100 strips for $18, I'm switching!

I'm totally with you. Even the strips for the Confirm would be slightly higher than the copay I pay for strips. The Prime, even better.

[Hammer]

The only problem with this theory is that the insurance companies are not the purchasers of medical products. They themselves do not buy the test strips. They
are highly regulated by federal, state and local mandates. Insurance companies act , I'd say, as mediators with vendors and providers and their customers (patients)
in contractual agreements to provide services for a specific set price point. This varies greatly from state to state and locality. For instance, if you live in certain
states, and wish to purchase health insurance..then your policy MUST cover hair plugs. This is because, generally..some litigation at some point determined that
there must be a law requiring all health insurance in that state to cover hair plugs. Therefore, your premiums go up. Among other reasons.
It's the conglomerate of those participating in buying the coverage that makes the benefits of a whole advantageous (or not). So when you go to buy those
medications or glucose meter from the pharmacy..you are paying the agreed upon copay (or no copay, depending on your coverage) between your insurer and the
manufacturer they are obligated.
I'm not defending nor supporting, but the comparisons to other industries are not apt. It's a bit more convoluted, and complicated.

When I order test strips, even though I am ordering them, the insurance company pays for them. I pay nothing for my test strips so the insurance company pays for them. The price that the insurance company pays is less than what I'd pay if I had to pay for them myself, so why does the test trip supplier charge me more than what the insurance company pays? If the test strip supplier can sell them to me through the insurance company for less, the test strip supplier isn't losing money at that price so why charge me even more money if I have no insurance?

It's the same thing with prescription meds. If I go to Wal-Mart and have a prescription filled, the total cost of that prescription (what the insurance covers added to my co-pay) is one price. If another person had the exact same prescription filled but they had to pay for it out of their pocket, they would pay a lot more than what mine cost. I asked the pharmacist about this and he said that the pharmacy could only charge me a certain amount for meds.....even if that med wasn't covered by my insurance. The fact that I had insurance forced the pharmacy to only charge me a little over their cost for the meds, whereas if I had no insurance, they could charge me whatever they felt like charging me. What bothered me is that those who are being charged the most are those who can least afford it, so why charge people a lot more for the meds when they can still make a profit by only charging a little over their price like they do me? If the pharmacy is surviving by making a 10% profit off of my prescription, then why do they have to make a 200% profit off the next guy?

[labrat]

When I order test strips, even though I am ordering them, the insurance company pays for them. I pay nothing for my test strips so the insurance company pays for them. The price that the insurance company pays is less than what I'd pay if I had to pay for them myself, so why does the test trip supplier charge me more than what the insurance company pays? If the test strip supplier can sell them to me through the insurance company for less, the test strip supplier isn't losing money at that price so why charge me even more money if I have no insurance?

It's the same thing with prescription meds. If I go to Wal-Mart and have a prescription filled, the total cost of that prescription (what the insurance covers added to my co-pay) is one price. If another person had the exact same prescription filled but they had to pay for it out of their pocket, they would pay a lot more than what mine cost. I asked the pharmacist about this and he said that the pharmacy could only charge me a certain amount for meds.....even if that med wasn't covered by my insurance. The fact that I had insurance forced the pharmacy to only charge me a little over their cost for the meds, whereas if I had no insurance, they could charge me whatever they felt like charging me. What bothered me is that those who are being charged the most are those who can least afford it, so why charge people a lot more for the meds when they can still make a profit by only charging a little over their price like they do me? If the pharmacy is surviving by making a 10% profit off of my prescription, then why do they have to make a 200% profit off the next guy?

That's the influence of too many of the wrong regulation. The system is broke. I don't know if you read the part about hospital list prices for labs services being 2.5 to 3.5 x's the cost of the base price. That's to absorb, or reflect, a cost that that ultimately will be 1/3 or less reimbursed. For example: say a CBC costs the laboratory $30.00 dollars to run. That's the price based on techologist labor time, reagents, consumables, instrument, RVUs , etc..everything calculated down to the actual cost that the laboratory incurs themselves for running one CBC. In my area, because CMMS regulates by regions..CMMS reimbursement is roughly half the $32.OO. Last I saw, our list price for a CBC was 42.00. That was a few years ago, I've not worked in hematology in awhile. It's nearly the same principal for the markup for self pays. Your insurance company isn't "giving" your strip manufacturer the difference , or rather "paying" the rest for your strips. They have a contractual agreement with that company. My guess would be that they've agreed a set base price , depending on tier and level, for the consumers who are part of your health insurance plan. Not individual, but Insurance Company A contracts with Pharmaceutical Company Z for Glucose Meters and supplies. They won't cover other manufacturers because they're in an agreement.
This is to benefit their pooled consumers, in theory. Say you participate in a particular health care plan and contribute 300 dollar a month. You get certain reduced payment plans, copays, and perks. There are 5000 people contributing the same, or variable amounts for the same level of health insurance coverage. Not all these people utilize the same level of services. Previously, the insurance company relied on healthy individuals utilizing their health care minimally, in order to have lower costs. Today, with regulations, and increasing population of federal assistance medical programs (please, not dogging medicaid/medicare, it's necessary), manufacturers of supplies must give reduced cost, or even free cost to the patients receiving said supples due to regulations.
In order to cover the costs of these services...the supply costs or retail costs are pushed higher and higher. The non-insured persons are forced to pay that highly absurd cost.
Honestly, the Relion strips at Walmart are not going to influence the cost of strips for Bayer, Roche, etc because those companies will still contract with insurance companies, included Medicaid/Medicare. And at this time insurance is necessary for many people. Can't live with it, can't live without it. Market principal cannot be applied in that case. IF, Relion were to contract with a particular insurance conglomerate (private or public)..I bet those prices would jump.

[poodlebone]

HI,I just bought 100 onetouch my insurance and i paid $132.00 for 100 test strips,these test strips were first issued i believe in
about 1980 if you can believe the internet,if so then you would think they should have gotten most if not all of their R&D back
by now.

The original One Touch meters & strips were very different from what is out now. I think Lifescan's first One Touch meter was the One Touch Basic, and they later came out with the One TOuch Profile and maybe something like One Touch II. Those three meters took the same strips. They were nothing like the One Touch Ultra series of strips & meters that are out now. They worked by detecting a change in color on the strips. THose meters required a massive drop of blood and took 45 seconds to run a test. I remember that I liked to watch the tiny lights flashing under the strip as the meter did its thing. I was using the One Touch Profile in the mid 90s, maybe 1995 or 1996. I used it until 2004 even though newer meters came out that took less time and used less blood.

My strips are covered by insurance and my One Touch UltraLink meter sends the readings to my pump, so I have no incentive to switch. I do wish that every single person who pays out of pocket would switch to the Relion meters/strips. Maybe then the other companies will see the light and try to be more competitive.

[masa_inn]

The price is permanent:
Walmartstores.com: Walmart Launches Effort to Save Diabetes Patients Up to $60 Million Annually

Of course, I am switching. Just bought Prime; compared results with my RelyOn Mini - they differ by 4 points.