help

[leigh4095]

hello, i've had diabetes for just over 1year, i take 40u lantus in the morning and about 22u humulog. it's taken a lot of trial and error to get things settled down but i still have 1 problem. when i get up im usually between 5.5-7.8 but then 2hrs after breakfast i sometimes go up to 12.5-16.0, all i have to eat is toast, and i take 10u humulog, which is more than i need to take at any other time. i cant figure out why this happens, it normally comes down before lunch and then everything is fine for the rest of the day. can anyone give me any advice, it would be helpfull,

thanks, leigh x :confused:

[Oradev]

i think this is the dawn phenomenon. It has something to do with your body not absorbing insulin as well in the morning. I have the exact same thing happen to me everyday. I wake up with sugars around 80 - 120 and two hours after breakfast have sugars in the 200's. Try eating less carbs and more protein or fat. (i.e. Bacon, PeanutButter w/ toast, Eggs,) I would stay away from Cereal. Cereal is the devil in the morning!!!

[Oradev]

Sorry, the dawn phenomenon happens before you wake. I was wrong. But it still could be your body not absorbing insulin in the morning. Ask the people around here what they eat in the morning.

Adam

[HeatherP]

I used to have the same problem on Regular insulin, but things got better after I switched to Humalog. You might try adding some protein to your bkfst to slow down carb absorption and avoid big spikes. I eat two pieces of bacon w/ my toast. I suppose, though, depending on what your cholesterol levels are that may or may not work for you. That's my suggestion though. A CDE may help you find something that works for you that you wouldn't think of, so if you have one, I'd suggest calling and asking that question.

Hope this helps a bit,
HeatherP

[leigh4095]

thank you adam and heather for your advice, i'll try eating something different for a while, see if it helps, it makes me feel better knowing that someone else is having or has had the same problem, now i know its not just me. thanks again :)

[rzrbks]

leigh4095,

Peanut butter and Jelly sandwich with cup of tea every morning for breakfast here. And I don't have inject cause I use less than a Tablespoon of PB and about teaspoon of Smucker's No Sugar jelly but that it enough (for me) to slow down absorption of Carbs enough so I don't have spike of more than 120/6.6.

There is a down-side to Peanut butter but than can be off-set with fruit and vegetables.

[Andrea]

Hi Leigh,

Do you only take one injection of Lantus in the AM? It sounds like your lantus might not be lasting a full 24 hours. The early morning hours tend to be the time when many people need the most insulin. If your basal insulin is not lasting 24 hours, then you are getting the least amount of insulin at this time of day.

What happens if you skip breakfast and don't give your morning Humalog? Does your blood glucose level still go up? If so, this has nothing to do with your breakfast, but more likely to do with your basal insulin levels.

Why do you take the lantus in the AM instead of before bed? Have you ever thougt of splitting the dose and taking half in the morning and half in the evening? It is one possible solution to lantus that does not last long enough. Talk to your endo about it.

Andrea

[leigh4095]

hi, i take one injection of lantus am, do most people take it at night? i'm not sure if the lantus is lasting 24hrs, i think so because when i wake up my levels are ok, unless its just running out then and it takes time for the next lot to kick in. i've never skipped breakfast and humulog so not sure what would happen, i think my level would still go up, so maybe it is because i take lantus in the morning? it all gets confusing sometimes.. i think i'll phone the nurse this afternoon and ask her which she thinks is best, try splitting the dose or maybe just take it at night, its gotta be worth a try. thank you all for your help :)
p.s. i haven't seen any sugar-free jam/jelly here, does anyone know where i can get some from? i've tried co-op, safeway and tesco all with no joy, unless i just haven't looked properly

leigh x

[Rainsunbow]

Hey Leigh!

I'm Leigh too! Not many people have my name here in the US. Is it common in England?

[rzrbks]

leigh4095,

I think that most of us on Lantus take it at night, something to do with proper absorption or some such--anyway, that might be worth a try--switching to right before bedtime or at least late in the evening--that way absorption might better cover your "Late Dawn Phenomenon"

was wondering if the Lantus and humalog aren't battling each other when injected that close together

just thoughts--Free Advice is worth what you pay for it:D

[HeatherP]

No problem injecting Lantus and Humalog at about the same time - I do it every day @ bkfst & dinner. (don't mix it together though)

Smuckers makes a light "sugar-free" jam/jelly that I like. It does contain a small amount of carbs, though - 5 gms/carbs per tbsp. I've bought it at Safeway and Nob Hill/Raley's.

HeatherP

[leigh4095]

hi all, well i've just got off the phone with the nurse and says she wants me to try upping the humulog at breakfast for a few days, see if that makes a difference, lets hope i don't go the other way and have hypos. if things are still the same on friday i've got to phone back and we'll think of maybe changing the time i take lantus, so i'll just have to wait and see. thank you everyone for your help and advice.
thanks heather, the jam's probably been staring me in the face the whole time and i just aint seen it. :o

[leigh4095]

hi rainsunbow,

nice to hear from someone with the same name. leigh isn't really that much of a common name over here either, i only know 2 other people called leigh, one's a girl and one's a boy.
:)

[DeusXM]

You'll probably have trouble finding Smuckers over here though cuz it's a Yank brand - never seen it here, not even in ASDA or Safeway, the North American owned supermarkets. There IS a company that makes 'diabetic jam', though I can't remember what it's called though.

Personally though, I'd never buy 'diabetic jam', for three very good reasons:

1. Jam's minging.
2. Buying the stuff is a bit like putting a label on yourself.
3. Usually, the way they sweeten it instead of sugar is to use sorbitol, which although technically not a sugar, has been proven (both medically and from my personal experience) to still have a significant effect on bg levels. Plus, it's a laxative and gives you the runs :(

[Andrea]

Leigh,

If the lantus is not lasting 24 hours, then just changing the time of the dose might not be enough. Yes, most people take it at night because that was the way it was originally marketed when it became available since it gives you the potential ability to sleep in since you have a (theoretic) constant basal rate and no morning injection to get up for. But the most important thing is to take it at about the same time every day. It doesn't really matter if it is morning or night.

Make sure you keep a good record of your blood glucose levels as you make these changes so that you can show your nurse and together you can come up with a solution based on your observances.

As for the jam, i am with Deus. I would never buy 'diabetic' or 'sugar free' jam. It is twice as expensive, tastes like **** and if it is sweetened with sugar alcohols, like deus pointed out, it gives major GI distress. I would rather have regular jam (i'm a homemade jam junkie) and just give the correct dose of insulin for the carbs i am eating.

Andrea

[HeatherP]

I just want to say, that the Smuckers brand I mentioned contains:

Water
Strawberries
Polydextrose
Maltodextrin
Fruit Pectin
Locust bean gum (huh?)
Citric Acid
Aspartame
Natural Flavor (whatever the **** that means)
Potassium Sorbate (a preservative)
Calcium Chloride
Red #40



5 gms/carbs per tbsp

[zookeeper671]

Doin' the Smuckers Light Sugar Free high-five to Heather....

Lookin' pretty silly standing still, hand in the air, Robin Williams type goofy grin on face...

[lumplump]

Wether you take Lantus in the evening or morning, your A1C is a better sign of your progress.

[Andrea]

Yuk! :)

I'd rather have double the carbs per tbsp in my jam than to eat all the **** they put in 'light' jam!

My jam contains water, strawberies, sugar and pectin.

Andrea