This takes some rough work

[cheryl]

Ok, yesterday, I was aiming to keep my bg around the 80's what a god awful hard thing to do, well not really but it takes some work.....my morning bg was god awful high yesterday.....grrrrrrrrrr........emotional breakdown Friday, explains a lot.

Well got to the 80's by lunch yay............so i was steady till dinner it dropped to 68 but i was in the car and my hubby had a coke so I took a tiny sip, rolling it in my mouth lol.............well, I was good for dinner about 81 now, so I just ate my dinner about 2 hrs later I dropped to 69, but I didn't do a thing...........because i was sitting down by the computer..........about 20 minutes later it went up to 73 by bedtime I was at 94 cool.............so anyway.............took my lantus went to bed but then woke up at 58 darn........but I didn't do a thing, just sipped a little juice very little rolled it in my mouth and ate my breakfast ever so slowly now I am awaiting the inevitable what is my bg..........lol...............I am trying to see how the **** someone can stay constantly in the under 100's range all the time without having a slight hypo...........this is very hard to do.............don't see how I could ever get an a1c in the 4's i get a little low when the insulin peaks grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.......

How the **** do you all do it if you do? If your on insulin and are type 1

Cheryl

[JediSkipdogg]

I never aim for around 80. I aim for 100-110 because I have a pretty high hypoglcemic unawareness. I can be 80 and then drop to 60 in 10 minutes and never know. And I do that with the pump.

I myself am amazed for those that can get a low A1C. But I guess they can keep their numbers low without a problem.

[DeusXM]

I am trying to see how the **** someone can stay constantly in the under 100's range all the time without having a slight hypo

Why would you want to do this anyway? Even people without diabetes don't stay under 100 24/7, so there's no health benefits in you trying to do so. Why would you want an A1C in the 4s? WHO guidelines say that an A1C of below 7% is enough to significantly reduce your risk of complications and 4-6% is the non-diabetic range.

[cheryl]

oh, i meant a lot of the times, not when you initially consume your food, but a few hours later sorry, I know we all spike when we eat......I am just curious honestly if there are any who actually have an a1c in the 4's that is type 1, that do not have hypo's constantly. That is what I am wondering, because what happened to me yesterday and this morning, I would not personally want to live like that either, I am really just curious to see if anyone can honestly answer me......Cause i am sick and tired of reading you must have this low low a1c to live complication free..............so I was wondering if anyone actually achieves a low low low a1c without a ton of hypo's, wondering if that is possible.................but I couldn't live like what happened yesterday trust me. Personally I don't get nervous until my bg goes past 140, and of course that is hours after i have ate, I am not that looney lol

Cheryl

[LancetChick]

My goal is also to have A1c's in the 4's, since I know all too well that complications can occur with A1c's in the low 6's, but my goal eludes me. My A1c's are very low 5's, however, and I live very comfortably with that. While I wouldn't want to be in the 50's and 60's all the time, I drop into that range fairly often. I always like to wake up in that range, since I know that my blood sugar is rising in the morning (no, not from rebounding), and I don't want to get too high if I don't feel like eating breakfast. Yesterday, I tested at 63 in the afternoon, and it didn't bother me at all, even though I can "feel" when I'm in that range. If dropping into the upper 50's and 60's range makes you feel uncomfortably hypo, that's no way to live. Just aim for the lowest range you feel comfortable in, and you may find that it changes over time. Keeping your blood sugars stable is also important, and will help to keep you from being hypo-unaware in that range.

[cheryl]

You sound like me........the range doesn't necessarily bother me, but then if I show the darn doc's my low sugars they go nuts lol..............if I wake up low, I know I will rise too....so if I were to adjust my lantus even more it doesn't cover that rise I get in the early morning so I am kind of stuck here right now lol......I can usually tell if it is a 60's need to be corrected or just to leave it alone..........if I am active yea, I need to fix it but if I am just sitting around no I can leave it alone too...........So when is low just too low than, I am never hypo unaware, I can usually feel it about all the time.........but it is not uncomfortable, cause i can tell which hypo's to fix if that makes any sense.........

Here is my biggest problem, my lovely body either wants to be in the 60'-90's or let's just say 150's-180's for some reason it doesn't want to stabilize inbetween lol......for real that is the way I work grrrrrrrrrrr....so it drives me batty too.....cause the docs don't like the low numbers but i don't like those higher numbers

Cheryl

[duck]

Cheryl, if you want to try and maintain a sub-100 blood sugar level, read the Bernstein book. I am not at a point in my life where I could adopt his strategies, but it is an interesting read, and if nothing else, there are some people who are able to accomplish that goal.

[moorejames]

Cheryl, if you want to try and maintain a sub-100 blood sugar level, read the Bernstein book. I am not at a point in my life where I could adopt his strategies, but it is an interesting read, and if nothing else, there are some people who are able to accomplish that goal.

I just got his diet book in the mail and started reading it. Some good stuff there. I have his other book on order (there's a new version being released in March).

He makes some seriously good points in his methods. Might not be for everyone, but it's hard to argue with his logic (so far, anyway).

[Doug]

I just got his diet book in the mail and started reading it. Some good stuff there. I have his other book on order (there's a new version being released in March).

He makes some seriously good points in his methods. Might not be for everyone, but it's hard to argue with his logic (so far, anyway).
The logic is ok .. the approach and the tone bother the **** out of me...

I just bought the book recently and have been reading it a little at a time ...

Let me summarize his approach. Nothing short of a 4.x a1c is good enough, any BG over 85 is causing damage that will kill you, his typical carb allowance for a day is 30 grams - for the entire day. He considers cheese to be a carb. he considers microwaving american cheese to make pufffy bread like things for sandwiches a normal thing. His list of No No foods includes just about everything. A vegetable salad is a non no.

His technique for avoiding the carb cravings is self hypnosis - 15 to 20 times a day

I have a number of issues with his approach - mostly that its unattainable for people that have to work outside the home. And that he claims he has no complications yet in the forward to the book he admits that he has leg issues from treatment prior to the 80s
Finally when you see him on TV - on the Dlife show - he looks like death warmed over.

Ok you get the idea...

I agree that the lower carbs you consume the better your BG will be and you will have less excursions form normal. And there are some good ideas in the book. I may try the intramuscular correction bolus sometime. But he has taken it all to a psycotic extreme in my opinion.

It reminds me of a conversation I have had with Drs and nurses and others in the past. Im a human who is also diabetic not a diabetic that is also human. I already spend too much of my day managing my disease - I wont let it take over my life.

[JediSkipdogg]

Doug....1 word....well said. That is exactly how I feel. His logic is partially OK, but also skewed somewhat. However, his methods are psychotic in my opinion. It may work for some, but I would think that's the point that you are letting diabetes control your life instead of you controlling it. By bowing down to the power of food and letting it say what you can and can't eat is just crazy. Especially since even those without diabetes can hit 150 on occasion depending on what they eat.

[cheryl]

oh god I am not ready for no carbs blah..................

I do feel the lower amount of insulin you are on your gonna have to dose for cheese, if i eat cheese more than 2 slices for two days in row I will go high, so i just eat it once in a while cause obviously everyday I am gonna have to dose for it too, just seeing it in myself......I don't think dosing for cheese is stupid, but I do feel takin away fruit is so i cannot agree with all of Dr. Bernstein's diet options.............fruit is natural and so are grains and veggies imo, i can ever take that away from my diet............i don't see the difference in dosing for high carb diet and dosing for a low carb diet cause it all the same to me your gonna need insulin for it

Cheryl

[cheryl]

I think my major problem here is trying to find a balance, if i stick with the same foods the same diet the same activity, i do fine, if i change my diet around and I get lazy and all i go up...............I just got to accept the fact that I have to learn how to dose properly for proteins and fats when it is applicable too, and when to just move around just a bit to keep my metabolism normal.......and in staying normal I can achieve a good bg.......but I am still trying to figure what each food and all does to me.......just so i can still have a variety and know how to deal with it.......and maintain a good bg............I have learned to cut out certain things out of my diet so I can have some things that would oh god shock people and then, I am learning how to figure a way to eat certain things with other things, it's really about balance and what you want to eat and how to figure your insulin with your food choices..............

Cheryl

[LancetChick]

I read a chapter of Dr. Bernstein's book online, and it sounded too much like an infomercial for my taste. Besides, I have my best blood sugars eating at least 100g carb. Smaller quantities of carbs give me a little spike because the lower insulin dose doesn't match my digestion curve as well. I've noticed such huge variations in what works for different people that it seems nonsensical to prescribe the same approach for everyone, if that's what Dr. Bernstein is doing.

[SueM]

Well I'm just so pleased I'm not 1 of Dr B's patients :eek:

I doubt if I have ever had an A1c below 6.8 in 42 yrs of being on insulin.
I eat what I want. I do not eat junk food/take aways but only because I don't like them.
Oh and I consume aprox 250 carbs/day and
I have no complications from diabetes either.

[cheryl]

Well I'm just so pleased I'm not 1 of Dr B's patients :eek:

I doubt if I have ever had an A1c below 6.8 in 42 yrs of being on insulin.
I eat what I want. I do not eat junk food/take aways but only because I don't like them.
Oh and I consume aprox 250 carbs/day and
I have no complications from diabetes either.



Thanks Sue,

Reading that makes me feel so much better, I had horrible a1c's my whole diabetic life, now I know I had to get my bg's better but I don't have any complications from being in the 8's - 11's all the time but I know I need them better, but I feel pretty good where I am at......just have to do some tweaking to get it just about so.....and yes i eat almost 200 carbs a day too

Cheryl

[duck]

Doug completely summarized my feelings as if my conscience were writing. But still, I would advise EVERYONE here to read the Bernstein book, much in the same way I advise everyone to read Pumping Insulin. There is a plethora of info in these books, and if even one facet makes your fight against diabetes easier, then it's worth the time and effort. This disease (for now) is lifelong.

Again, like pumping, I do not think the Bernstein way of life is for everyone, and I also have argued here with a few Bernsteiners that their WOL won't work for all, the human genome is so diverse that some things will work very, very well for some, and work like poop for others. But again, his book was very educational to say the least, and it may be emancipating for some.

But yeah, being part-Korean, the thought of giving up rice is as weird to me as not breathing...

[grace girl]

Shooting for 80 would terrify me...I don't seem to have a problem dropping 20-40 points sometimes within what seems like seconds. Just way to close to hypo for comfort.
My target is 110....and it's a target, let me tell you. I'm getting better and better at it, but it seems to me that it just takes time to know your body, know how different foods and activities affect you.....I've been on MDI since last June, and I feel like I've still got so much to learn!
For example, I've just come to see in the last month that I seem to be really sensitive to humalog...it's not that my carb ratios are super high, I've just really begun to see how easily I can go hypo from that stuff. It's taken MONTHS to get my lantus worked out, and I think that's why I didn't see it before.

[BlueSky]

Bernstein simply provides a technique for achieving normal blood sugars. If you don't see the need for them, there is no reason to follow to his restrictive guidelines. But that doesn't invalidate anything he says. The guiding principle is, you improve BG control by reducing carbohydrates, and trhe less carb/insulin you use, the fewer hypos you get. You can apply this principle to the extent that makes sense in your life. I, for example, eat hardly any carb for breakfast and dinner. But for lunch, I eat what is available and it usually includes varying amounts of carb. My BG levels are far from normal. But they are, in my view, satisfactory. And, most importantly, my BG levels are pretty stable.

If you are happy with where your control is at, there is no reason to change anything. :wink:

[cheryl]

I get such mixed reviews I just love it........I came from one side of the family that will eat as natural as possible and another side that will keep on piling in the ****.......I have a mixed diet lol...........try to stay away from most of the **** but there is a minimal amount of things that are just too hard to give up 100% totally for me as of yet...........

But I do believe that if it grows you are meant to eat it unless your like allergic to it of course.....and you know what sucks for me in my situation, I have extreme issue's with aspertame which has scared me so much that I don't even want to test out splenda, so yea, I can't be one of those that oh god i want just a soda and can reach for that diet, or oh god that icecream is so good and it has barely no carbs........there is not secert special treat for me........so yea, when everyone is like oh go no carbs or low carbs how many of you actually don't occasionally have a diet or a sugar free this........trust me it is hard when you can't even fall back on that............you get my point.....


My tdd insulin is actually down to about 28-30 units a day and still i get hypo grrrrrrrr.....drives me nuts that is why I just want to give in to the 60's sometimes, cause it drives me loco..........but oh well if i give up more I have nothing to live for lol.................i loves me some food and i aint' ashamed to say it..........

Cheryl

[JediSkipdogg]

My tdd insulin is actually down to about 28-30 units a day and still i get hypo grrrrrrrr.....drives me nuts that is why I just want to give in to the 60's sometimes, cause it drives me loco..........but oh well if i give up more I have nothing to live for lol.................i loves me some food and i aint' ashamed to say it..........

Cheryl

Remember, it takes years of running high to do any damage. But only 5 minutes of running low to kill you.

[cheryl]

Yes, I know I had a big wake up call today actually,

Listent to this years I was on nph, I was also drinking diet soda's like water, ok I got these god awful sleep spells, let me explain. I am asleep right, and all of a sudden I want to wake up, because my body isn't feeling right, ok but when I try it kind of feels like my body shuts down, and I feel like I am not breathing, and then boom I snap out of it......OK, this has happened to me for years on nph, and diet soda..........so anyway dumb *** me, excuse my french, but I was a *******, never checked my bg when I awoke from these sleep spells...........and I was shakey and sweating and it was just werid. So I stopped drinking diet soda and no artificial sweetner anymore, and also around the same time, I started on Lantus..........well those sleep spells just magically stopped.......Well, I had a handful I guess in the last few years after I started taking lantus, actually I had more when I was pregnant with my son Jacob, which makes sense, cause I was having better blood sugars and trying to stay controlled. Well guess what................



Yep I had one last night, and it didn't really hit me at first to check my bg cause I felt really lost by the time I stumbled and smart Cheryl, cause she is no longer a *******, came too, I checked my bg it was 58 and this was in the early morning.................well I was chatting with a buddy of mine a few hrs ago and it dawned on me.......holy sh$%^%t, I actually had bad bad low's in the middle of the night for years and all, and never put two and two together, because I blamed it on the nutrasweet..............wow, yes wake up call today, don't worry............God was with me thru the years, but still, omg........I cannot believe i am not dead.......but yes, I am going to be very leary of being low at night or in the morning again, screw that I have kids that need me..........................Yes, I need some serious help :T

Cheryl

[LancetChick]

Cheryl, what do you consider a bad low? The only way 50's can be considered bad or scary is if you are used to being high. Mind you, I'm not comfortable in that range either, but I don't consider a reading in the 50's to be a bad, mind-altering low.

[dbc]

Cheryl, if you want to try and maintain a sub-100 blood sugar level, read the Bernstein book. I am not at a point in my life where I could adopt his strategies, but it is an interesting read, and if nothing else, there are some people who are able to accomplish that goal.

I read the book soon after diagnosis. I agree, it is full of good info on the nature of diabetes. The way of eating is something else..... I follow a somewhat modified version of his plan, to the extent that I can live with it, and have kept my A1c between 6 & 7% for almost 3 years of honeymoon. But I am almost looking forward to starting insulin (next week), because it'll give me the option of eating foods that have been excluded for the last 3 years!

In his previous life, Bernstein was an engineer - engineers are control freaks, so his approach to managing his diabetes doesn't surprise me! Maybe because I'm also in engineering is why I've managed to stick with the diet.....

[cheryl]

Cheryl, what do you consider a bad low? The only way 50's can be considered bad or scary is if you are used to being high. Mind you, I'm not comfortable in that range either, but I don't consider a reading in the 50's to be a bad, mind-altering low.

It's not a bad bad low, but like i said I don't know what was going on for a little bit and sorry I should of explained myself in even more detail, while i was lost I did find some candy missing from my stash and my mouth did kind of taste like chocolate.............so I think I did fix myself while I was out of it, but I honestly don't remember......


Cheryl

[cheryl]

I read the book soon after diagnosis. I agree, it is full of good info on the nature of diabetes. The way of eating is something else..... I follow a somewhat modified version of his plan, to the extent that I can live with it, and have kept my A1c between 6 & 7% for almost 3 years of honeymoon. But I am almost looking forward to starting insulin (next week), because it'll give me the option of eating foods that have been excluded for the last 3 years!

In his previous life, Bernstein was an engineer - engineers are control freaks, so his approach to managing his diabetes doesn't surprise me! Maybe because I'm also in engineering is why I've managed to stick with the diet.....


I know I have had the d for so long and have lived with so many healthy people I can probably almost tell you what the man has to say......I don't type as good as I can think or express my words in conversation, but I know what he is doing and I know he is very strict, I read a couple of things he has said and just reading what people say about him, you kind of know what he is saying, I have decided that, because for me right now it is too complicated on the Lantus, that whatever my basal needs are specifically, when I am doing my normal activity, I am going to match that with my bolus needs like about half, so if I need like so and so units per meal, I will see how many carbs that will be and that will be my carb intake, figuring that is how my body is working and those are probably my needs..........for those days.......makes sense to me

Cheryl

[June91]

The only way 50's can be considered bad or scary is if you are used to being high. Mind you, I'm not comfortable in that range either, but I don't consider a reading in the 50's to be a bad, mind-altering low.


58 (3.2) is low. And perception and effects of a hypo are an individual thing rather then a set value.

Bad and mind-altering experiences as you say, have happened to me at anything under 4, but I've had hypos under 2.5 with no effect whatsoever.

You're not wrong LancetChick, but a lot of newbies read this stuff, and I'd rather have them think 58 is low.

[JasonJayhawk]

I myself am amazed for those that can get a low A1C. But I guess they can keep their numbers low without a problem.

I agree. I'm a skeptic, though, when it comes to reports of an A1c in the 4.x range by everyday laypersons. Two things could be in play:

1) Their hemoglobin is different, and thus the glycosylation measurement is not accurate for their genetics.
-or-
2) They are not paying attention to the lab's reference range. Someone reporting an A1c of 4.5% with a ref range of 5.5% is not as impressive as someone reporting an A1c of 5.2% with a ref range of 6.5%.
-or-
3) Lab error. (hee hee)

I'm not a disbeliever, just a skeptic. I'd also like to see how many hypo's the person has, as well as a measurement of the quality of their life.

A1c's are still not standard amongst all the labs. What happened to the "old days" when people used to report the lab and city location where their A1c was done!

[HelenM]

Cheryl
don't see how I could ever get an a1c in the 4's i get a little low when the insulin peaks grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.......
Jason
I'd also like to see how many hypo's the person has, as well as a measurement of the quality of their life

For most of the day my BS is in the 80's but by accident rather than design. I'm happy about it but I wouldn't reduce my quality of life if it was impossible to obtain.

My HBA1C is low - not in the 4's: the latest was 5% (for Jason: ref technique HPLC-TOSOH A1c 2.2. Technique certifiée NGSP/DCC1. R * non diabetic <6%, type 1 <7%, type 2<6.5% result checked by a second lab .)

I have hypos. I'm sure (from the symtoms) that I had hypos before I was diabetic and know that my non diabetic husband has them as I've tested him when he's felt that he needed food quickly after some hard manual work. The difference is that his body will cut the insulin ours can't.
I have at least one hypo a day. For me they are no big deal as I have always been able to correct easily. I can usually predict them as they always occur during or after exercise. Maybe I'm too blasé, its certainly why my doctor has suggested a pump.

I don't low carb , I enjoy eating too much and probably eat at least 200 gms a day. I do try to eat low G1 but am not fanatical.

My BS is normally betwen 90 and 120 after a meal but sometimes rises to about 140. I normally see the highest readings 3 hours, not 2 after a meal. Very occasionally it is higher (bad calculation, stress, etc and I use a correction dose)

I exercise for at least an hour a day, running about 25 miles a week plus other cardio and pilates on non running days. If I don't exercise my BS is higher.


My conclusion is that the exercise keeps my average BS down but that it makes hypos almost inevitable. For many type 1's that could be perhaps be dangerous .In order to avoid frequent hypos they'd have to reduce insulin and start exercise with higher BS and thus have higher averages .

I have LADA and sometimes wonder if I have a more efficient counter regulatory system than some type 1's but this is just my own theory.

[JasonJayhawk]

(for Jason: ref technique HPLC-TOSOH A1c 2.2. Technique certifiée NGSP/DCC1. R * non diabetic <6%, type 1 <7%, type 2<6.5% result checked by a second lab .)

:D :D :D
I wish everyone had that information and could share it! :cool:

I've never had an A1c over 5.8% (< 6.0% ref) -- (yet...knock on wood... the twins aren't home from the NICU yet...!) I have at least one hypo a day, too, but nothing to write home about. It's part of the game.

BTW, Helen, I had a big grin on my face as I read your lab reference. Dang, that was good! ;)