if 1000 non diabetics had a1cs done

[pizzaman3]

and they all ate well no candy or sugar or cake only fish and vegies and healthy foods -----and if they were not over weight ---would there be a place on the internet to find out if there a1cs would be at the middle of the rainge like 5 it seems to me that, that would be the place where there a1cs would be becouse 4- to 6- is non diabetec rainge -----but it can be tricky becouse the only place to get info is on a diabetec site ----if i treat myself like a healthy diabetec than that is all i am----but if i follow health by the standerds of a non diabetec than i get the bottom line and not somthing that an endo or the ada was invaled with ---the reason i asked is becouse i went to see a doc and he said i am ok but i want to be shure becouse i like tighter controll than any doc will alow for a type 1 --- ---- had an a1c done yesterday up a little 5.2 ----from 5.1 on 4-5-07----anyway i am concerned becouse if my a1c should be lower i can do that i will take small doeses of humilog when my bs is at 90 to get it lower it may not seem like much but in the end it might make all the diferance in the world --i would like to find info that endos or ada didnt have any involevment with so the info would not be contaminated ---i hate to say it that way but i cant spell certian words that i need to youse to get the point across pizzaman current bs 78

[princesslinda]

I'm not sure there's anywhere on line that would have a study such as the one you suggest. In my way of thinking, the closer we as diabetics get to the non-diabetic levels, the better off we are complication wise. Therefore, if you are within the levels of a non-diabetic, those levels should serve you well. Suppose your lab considers normal A1C values of 4-6 and you are 5.4 or anywhere within the 4-6 range, i'd consider you to have very good control and be at very minimal risk for complications. To put yourself at an possible health risk to get lower normal doesn't make a lot of sense to me if you are "normal" to begin with. Since A1C is an "average" it can change on a daily basis, as blood sugars come up and go down, even in non-diabetics.

[volleyball]

Unless we were born of a split embryo, we are not identical machines. So there are variations. The A1C is a tolerance factor for us machines. Plus other problems and how the machine is maintained will make everyone getting the exact same number impossible.
The information is available from a variety of sources, it just that as diabetics, we are more concerned about it that the search engines will find sites like this more likely than others.
As a side note, modern browsers such as Firefox have spellcheckers built into them to correct your spelling making them easier to read by all of us.

[ladytaz]

Like princesslinda said, since there are fluctuations, there is no one exact "perfect" A1c number. Therefore it is a range of 4 to 6, since that is the range that non-Diabetics fall into. If a person with Diabetes falls anywhere in that range, that is considered a non-diabetic level of A1c. Good Job, then!

My last A1c was 6.0, I'm absolutely thrilled with that. If it stays right there for the rest of my life, I'll be slap happy! :) I just can't see risking more lows, or eating habits that make one unhappy [eating crappy tasting food, just cuz it's good for you and limiting carbs to an unhealthy level], just to "get a better grade on a test", which is exactly what that boils down to. If someone can get a lower number, and doesn't suffer in anyway, GREAT for them.

Our bodies aren't all created equally. How each of our bodies function, is different. Just like everything Diabetes, what works for one, doesn't necessarily work for another. We all have to do what works best for US, individually, rather than compete with each other on the A1c numbers game.

I know that damage occurs starting at a BG of 140, therefore I strive to keep mine below that, after meals, and I do pretty darn good at it too. Before meals, and when I awake, I'm usually somewhere between 80 and 110 [I usually awake in the 90's somewhere]. I'm happy with that.

To me, it's not a "numbers game". I set my BG goals, by what is considered safe, and also what I'm comfortable with. I'm not comfy with running around with a BG of 70 - 80 all the time. Makes me nervous, afraid of going low, and being nervous makes me stressed, which in turn makes me unhappy.

What's the point of it all if you're gonna be stressed all the time and unhappy?

Another thing ..... we ARE Diabetic. That's the difference between US and THEM! ;) You can not be, what you are not.

[notme]

Great posts Linda and taz. Couldn't have said it better myself. So..... I won't try. Thanks!

[BlueSky]

In the absence of insulin resistance, there is not much benefit in reducing the HBA1c below 6%. It results in only a marginal reduction of complication risk. I stopped chasing blood sugars down with insulin when I realised that it really wasn't getting me anywhere. My HBA1c is 6.5% on MDI, which is low enough from a complications risk perspective. Apparently the risk of complications increases by 40% for each 1% the HBA1c is above 5%. So at an HBa1c of 6%, the risk is 40% higher than it is at 5%. But the risk increases from a very low base at 5%, and it only becomes problematic when the HBA1c gets up to 7%.

Having said that, the closer to normal blood glucose is, the better. But I don't believe it is worth going to extreme lengths for a T1 to achieve an HBA1c of less than 6%.

[pizzaman3]

im getting a1cs in the low 5s and eating anything i want with out much effert ----iguess there is no anser to my question becouse ada and endos are invalved ---and becouse pre diabetecs are in the 4 to 6 rainge ----most diabetecs type 1 diabetecs have a1cs above 6 ----that is a fact-------so most non diabetec fall into a a1c rainge allso ----i understand what everybody is saying but my question still isnt answerd ---------------there has to be a rainge where most healthy nondiabetecs fall into i think it is below 5 slitly maybe 4.5or so i wish i could find out pizzaman current bs 55----im a little low i just ate pizza i allways make shure i stay low after i eat that way i dont go high it might be the roung thing to be doing i will find out some day when i die

[ladytaz]

Healthy NON-Diabetics fall into the 4-6 A1c range. I don't know who did the studies, but that doesn't matter. Facts are facts. No matter WHO does the study, they can't skew that fact!

The fact that you are having A1c's of low 5's is EXCELLENT! NON-Diabetic levels! So what's the problem here? I'm not understanding that.

Pat yourself on the back, and tell yourself "Good Job"! That's exactly what it is! You've done an excellent job at controlling your Diabetes! :)

[BlueSky]

Healthy NON-Diabetics fall into the 4-6 A1c range. I don't know who did the studies, but that doesn't matter. Facts are facts. No matter WHO does the study, they can't skew that fact! ...
pizzaman3 was asking what "normal" blood glucose is. An HBA1c of 6% might be "non-diabetic". But it is way higher than "normal". 6% just happens to be a the benchmark HBA1c above which a diagnosis of diabetes is made (although diagnosis is usually based on FBG). An HBA1c of 6% corresponds to an average blood glucose of 136mg/dl. This is high. Normal random blood glucose, it seems, is about 83 mg/dl, which corresponds to HBA1c of 4.5%.

I don't think a study has been done on this. And figures from diagnostic labs are not much help as they are skewed on the high side. Richard Bernstein figured that 83mg/dl is "normal" based on tests he did on visiting meter salesman, who were typically young and healthy males. The reading was usually about 83, with very little variability around this number.

The goal of diabetic control is to achieve "near-normal" levels. And it seems odd that finding out what is normal is so difficult. It is a bit like the cholesterol reduction crusade. I haven't been able to find out what "normal" is, only what the various stakeholders want everyone to think it should be.

[pizzaman3]

i would like to know if 1000 non diabetics it could be any number but it has to be a number to get a percentige---if 700 of them are having a1cs of 5.1 and 200 of them having a1cs of 4.4 and 50 having a1cs of 4.8 and 45 of them having a1cs of 5.3 and 5 of them having a1cs of 6 ----if that was the results without doing the math i can tell by looking at what i just wrote that i should lower my a1c quite a bit for longjevity perposes pizzaman current bs 95 good thing i checked time for humilog

[pizzaman3]

blue sky ----knowes what i am trying to find out

[Alice]

My last lab report (Quest) said non-diabetic range is less than 6.0.

[Ronin]

Pizzaman3, et al.,

Although this was posted on the Type-1 forum and I'm in the Pre-D contingent I'll add my $0.02 to the conversation as I've been wrestling with the issues of what constitutes "normal" for some time (as those who have followed my various posts already know).

My current position is that the range of acceptable values takes into account most of the variables that can influence the actual HbA1c readings. Age, activity levels, diet, et cetera all have an influence on what the actual readings will be from test-to-test.

While the HbA1c is the "standard" and is presented as a 90 day average, everything I have read says that the test is really a moving average weighted to the past four-to-six weeks out of the 13 week period. Hence, if you do a monthly test (as I have been doing lately) you get a pretty good picture of how the regimine you are following is working or not working.

Even though I'm very active and have seriously reduced the amount of carbohydrates I consume on a daily basis, my numbers stay in the low-to-mid five-percent range and I'm satisfied.

Right now I'm looking at all of the aspects of the "Metaboic Syndrome" which include Lipid Levels, Blood Pressure and annual retinal scans to the HbA1c results. At present all of these are in the good-to-excellent range and I'm going to keep on doing what I am doing.

While I tend to be obsessive, I also realize that obsessing over so many variables will only make me crazy. Accept that there is no perfect number and move on -- life is, in the end, about things other than numbers on a chart.

[pizzaman3]

alice i am trying to get more spicifick than 4 to 6

[Alice]

Ok, I'm thinking anything below a six is acceptable to a healthy human body...since all individuals have different chemistry...I don't think it's going to be very specific. But, good luck and let us know what you research.

[pizzaman3]

im not trying to make a big deal out of this post it was a question that i asked and that is all ----i feel if i ckeck my bs and it is 95 lets say----- i all ways take more insulin when my bs is 95 and i feel if i am going to test why not do somthing rathinal with the test results -----pizzaman current bs 44----thats what happens somtimes when i take insulin when my bs is 95 ----im ok liver is in semi overdrive good thing i checked just another low to add to my 40/000.00 lowes under my belt

[Cyborg]

pizzaman current bs 44

This is at least the 2nd post where you've qouted that. Is this some kind of joke? 44 is a completely unacceptable bg value!

[pizzaman3]

im ok i go to this number daily but i eat a peice of lickrish or candy or somthing to raize my bs

[painthorse]

im ok i go to this number daily but i eat a peice of lickrice or candy or somthing to raize my bs

Perhaps you don't have diabetes - just a very bad insulin habit!

[gettingby]

But why would you want to let your bg go that low. Running low on a continuous basis is as bad as running high on a continuous basis. That's just my honest opinion. I'm sure some may disagree.

[pizzaman3]

i wish that was true

[Cyborg]

Another member just went to the ER for a bg value such as that. I think I keep my bg a bit low at times, but that is just too low. If you get used to that value, how will you feel a life-threatening hypo?

[statdeac]

I'm starting to wounder if thiz thred is fore real. :s

[pizzaman3]

my blood work is good i go low daily ----low colesteral high hdl -----doc said how do i do it --if i go high i feel like im burning from the inside ------i dont stay low i go low after i eat so i can eat somthing else but im not overweight i dont eat a lot but i eat twice after diner and twice after lunch and twice after breakfast ----not becouse i want to becouse i have to workes for me ---see when i said i eat twice after diner and twice after lunch and breakfast its the same as 9 times a day ----that way i can controll my bs and never go over 100 and eat what ever i want in small amounts becouse my liver is empty and there is room in it for glycogyn when i eat ---that way there is a place for it to go ---it goes to the liver -i have a place to but it if i dont go low than it is easer to go high

[pizzaman3]

dont start saying im not for real becouse they did that to me on dlife -----ive been treating myself for 30 years no doc but i kept my a1cs non diabetec ive had 4 done in the last 30 years out of my 38 years with type 1 1992 5.8 1994 5 .3 2005 5.1 2007 5.2

[Cyborg]

You can achieve similiar a1c's without such great risk. One morning, you may not wake up if you keep it up...

http://bestsmileys.com/dead/1.gif

[pizzaman3]

its not all peaches and cream being this low things do hapen i just like to eat what i want when i want and things do hapen ------once every 6 monts i have a low parinoid distribing mightmair once i jumped out a window --cut myself all up ----these dreams are real and im awake but im in the dream -they are real bad ------my daily lows are all ok im ok with them had to many of them -----any way if they were painfull i wouldnt have them right? pizzaman current bs 103 good thing i checked 3 units of humilog get my self under control befor bed -----i may be diferant ----but i got to do somthing

[Cyborg]

You know that an a1c under 6.0 is considered non-diabetic right?

[Funnygrl]

This is at least the 2nd post where you've qouted that. Is this some kind of joke? 44 is a completely unacceptable bg value!
Of course it is, that's why he never answered my question here:
http://www.diabetesforums.com/forum/introductions-and-announcements/21390-if-i-wouldnt-eat.html

It's more than the second time hes done that.

He reminds me of a troll the yahoo message boards had back in the day.

[pizzaman3]

thanks locutose -----thanks everybody ----my wife and my son have bs that dont go over 88 im just trying to be like non diabetec ---becouse i dont want to be a diabetec and when i stay under 100 i feel wonderfull -----but the bad things hapen to -----but i dont have to wory about complications at this rainge ------i know cyborge 4 to 6 is non diabetec thanks for carring ---in my head i look back and i have know worries becouse i am still here and i know if i drop a can of pinapple on my big toe it wont mater becouse im ok and i like that feeling

[notme]

I am closing this thread down as it has veered way off topic.