Stinging Boluses

[belyro]

Does anyone else find that their boluses sting more after you've had your infusion set in for a couple of days already. I find it gets worse after about 2 days. Weird.

[xMenace]

I've never ever experienced a stinging bolus, but the sites can get sore.

[palefacegirl03]

So far no stinging, and sites have not bothered me any.
Still using only the quickset 9mm and no problems or any pain on insertion.

[RLK]

I find just the opposite actually. Mine sting right after I've put in a new site (which I kinda like- let's me know the insulin is getting through), but gradually get less painful.

Is the stinging bad enough to make you change out the set?

[KAnderson]

I don't have a stinging bolus very often, but when I do, it's usually right after I've change a site. They also go away after a few boluses.

Ken

[belyro]

Is the stinging bad enough to make you change out the set?

Not this time, but it has been.

[RobiJo]

Mine sting more when the site hurt more going in. Not usually enough to pull it out though. Maybe 1 out of 10 will sting a bit. Fluke of nature I suppose b/c they aren't kinked or anything.

[kgm0612]

I find just the opposite actually. Mine sting right after I've put in a new site (which I kinda like- let's me know the insulin is getting through), but gradually get less painful.

Same for me! It only stings during the fixed prime and then it disappears.

Karen

[Lloyd]

If you can slow down the rate at which the bolus is given, that can help. Some pumps allow you to do this,


-Lloyd

[MinimedPumper07]

Nope, not with the MM. With animas every bolus stung, but none so far with mm. Sometimes it does hurt a little when I insert the quickset, but thats the only pain i get...

[jimbob]

The only time mine stings is if I have an infected site. It's rare that it will sting but I know right away that the site is infected if it does. Just a heads up Beth.

[belyro]

The only time mine stings is if I have an infected site. It's rare that it will sting but I know right away that the site is infected if it does. Just a heads up Beth.

Then does it still ALL the time, or just when you bolus.

None of my sites have seemed infected yet.

[pumpman]

The Minimed's bolus speed is painfully slow. Compared with my Animas 1200, the minimed 722 takes nearly 10min to deliver my morning bolus and the Animas takes about 8 seconds.

I find the slower speed makes the sites last longer and delivery is less painful, but you have to wait so long...

When using the animas, i have to pinch the site while the insulin is delivering.

How long after the delivery does it start hurting?

[Cyborg]

Try using a short duration combo bolus to help with any stinging. If using an Animas pump, the shortest combo bolus is 0.1 hr (6 minutes).

If you do a 0/100 combo bolus over 1/2 hour and start it 1/2 hour before you eat, you won't feel any stinging and you are likely to see an improvement in post meal bg numbers...

[tanyatype1]

Sometimes a site will sting during a bolus if it's getting to be an old site. I've set my pump to delivery the insulin more slowly and if it's a large dose, I just do it in two different chunks, 10 minutes apart or something like that. Maybe divide the units between before and after dinner.

[JediSkipdogg]

The Minimed's bolus speed is painfully slow. Compared with my Animas 1200, the minimed 722 takes nearly 10min to deliver my morning bolus and the Animas takes about 8 seconds.

I find the slower speed makes the sites last longer and delivery is less painful, but you have to wait so long...

When using the animas, i have to pinch the site while the insulin is delivering.

How long after the delivery does it start hurting?

That is my main concern with the Minimed. If I eat Burger King for breakfast I take a 14 unit bolus. That's 9.3 minutes to get that bolus.

I'd love to know how Jeggeman is doing. I know he switched to the MM from the Animas because he needed a larger insulin cartridge. I believe when him and I went to eat lunch together once he took like a 30 unit bolus. That's 20 minutes to deliver that, and to me is outrageous.

Now, don't get me wrong, I think the Animas speed is outrageous in the other direction of being too fast. I personally wish that it would deliver at a rate of about 1 unit every 10 seconds. To me that's a good steady speed that shouldn't be a problem.

[tanyatype1]

That's an interesting difference between Animas and MM that I haven't read before. That's something that definately needs to be taken into consideration before buying a pump! Learn something new here everyday!

[JediSkipdogg]

Just to take this a step further...here are the actual "flow rates" for each of the pumps...

MM 522/722
1.5 u/minute

Animas
Bolus, under 1 U: 1.1 to 2.2 U/sec
Bolus, 1 U or more (normal delivery speed): 0.5 to 0.9 U/sec
Bolus, 1 U or more (slow delivery speed): 0.2 to 0.4 U/sec

Cozmo
Approximately 0.01 units per second minimum, 2.5 units per second maximum (based on bolus amount and bolus delivery time - bolus duration personalizable from 1 to 5 minutes)


I personally think the Cozmo wins hands down there. The Animas is too fast, the MM is too slow (and unchangeable), and the Cozmo you set how long you want it to take in 1 minute increments.

[pumpman]

Now, don't get me wrong, I think the Animas speed is outrageous in the other direction of being too fast. I personally wish that it would deliver at a rate of about 1 unit every 10 seconds. To me that's a good steady speed that shouldn't be a problem.

My thoughts exactly. Animas and Minimed are the two extremes in speed.

The Animas' bolus system shoots a massive burst too quickly and it sometimes stings. Minimed is just ridiculously slow.

[xMenace]

That mm rate seems awful slow compared to what I perceive as happenning. I've taken 25u's that did not take 37.5 minutes. I'll bet there's an unpublished sliding scale. I'll try to time some boluses this week.

[jimbob]

Then does it still ALL the time, or just when you bolus.

None of my sites have seemed infected yet.

No it usually only stung when I was bolusing. Who knows why?:confused: I'm also with X on the timing of bolusing for minimed. It doesn't seem to take as long as it says it should.

[Cyborg]

The Animas' bolus system shoots a massive burst too quickly and it sometimes stings. Minimed is just ridiculously slow.

1 unit per 3 seconds is hardly a massive burst when compared to MDI...

[JediSkipdogg]

That mm rate seems awful slow compared to what I perceive as happenning. I've taken 25u's that did not take 37.5 minutes. I'll bet there's an unpublished sliding scale. I'll try to time some boluses this week.

Wrong way on the math there pal. 25 units would take almost 17 minutes. ANd I don't think they can have a sliding scale and not publish it. All technical information for medical devices that could affect a user have to be published per FDA guidelines.

1 unit per 3 seconds is hardly a massive burst when compared to MDI...

Which amazes me, I never had a sting on MDI, but do quite a bit on the Animas pump.

[xMenace]

Wrong way on the math there pal. 25 units would take almost 17 minutes. ANd I don't think they can have a sliding scale and not publish it. All technical information for medical devices that could affect a user have to be published per FDA guidelines.


I actually realized my mistake some 2 hours later as I was bolusing. Funny how the brain works ;) It took about 17 minutes to do 25 units. I've had no issues with these rates, but I generally pre-bolus anyway.

[dgrilli]

Bottom Line I complained about Stinging Bolus's back in July of 2006 on these very same Forums with the Animas 1250.

What I found out was that I sit over an Air Conditioning Duct and my Insulin Got Cold in the pump and through the tubing.

Cold Insulin always stings and burns me.

The Animas 2020 not much different but it is very Quiet compared to the noisy 1250.

I have my Delivery Step set on .5

Whats yours set on Cyborg and you Belly Ro whats yours set on?

[Injecto]

I never seem to get bolus' that sting unless it's right after an insertion of a new set...and even then it's not common. I've probably only felt 5 stings since February.

[belyro]

Whats yours set on Cyborg and you Belly Ro whats yours set on?


I have a Paradigm 522, and to my knowledge (and per the discussion above), there is no way to alter the delivery speed.

[palefacegirl03]

I have not had any problem with stinging, one way or another,so hopefully it stays that way.

But you never know, with diabetes, the wind blowing can change things,lol

[tfisher]

Can I ask what made you decide on the Animas 2020 after trying the 722?

I am looking to start pumping in the next couple weeks and deciding bewteen the Animas 2020, MM 522 and OmniPOd. Right now, leaning towards 2020 w/ Dexcom SEVEN because of screen color, carb database and size. Also, found the MM menus to bee "too many buttons to accomplish a simple task". Any comments welcome.

Thanks!

[jeggeman31]

Does anyone else find that their boluses sting more after you've had your infusion set in for a couple of days already. I find it gets worse after about 2 days. Weird.

What infusion set are you using? I used the comfort with my Animas and had stinging all the time. After I changed to the 722 I changed to the quick-set and have had zero stinging. I do think that the stinging was due to what infusion set I was using, however the 1250 does have a faster delivery rate (even on the slow) than the 722 has.

Also when I was wearing the comfort I could only wear the set for about 48 to 50 hours. NO more. Now with the quick-set I forget when I put the set in, because I don't change out my cartridge and set at the same time. When it starts to peal itself off, or it starts itching I change my set. Now it is 3 to 5 days.

[jeggeman31]

I'd love to know how Jeggeman is doing. I know he switched to the MM from the Animas because he needed a larger insulin cartridge. I believe when him and I went to eat lunch together once he took like a 30 unit bolus.

Kevin it was 35 units :D

My numbers are much better with the 722. Now I don't know if it is due to the slower delivery of insulin during bolus or the infusion set I am using as I changed the type of set I use. It was hard getting use to the slow delivery of my bolus, and I think I am still trying to get use to it.

[belyro]

What infusion set are you using?

I've had it with both the Quicksets and the Silhouettes. Now I'm only using Silhouettes b/c I just couldn't get good comfortable sites with the Quicksets. I don't get it on every site, but probably at least 25% of the time - and even then, only after a day or so with the set in.

I'm finding I have to change them every 2-3 days or they start getting irritated too.

[Cyborg]

The Animas 2020 not much different but it is very Quiet compared to the noisy 1250.

I have my Delivery Step set on .5

Whats yours set on Cyborg and you Belly Ro whats yours set on?

The 2020 and the 1250 are the same pump except with different screens and firmware. I had both pumps (at the same time) and can tell you they act the same, including the rate at which they bolus and the amount of noise they make.

...BTW, I have my setting on the slowest delivery setting for boluses, but as stated earlier, almost always do at least a 0.1 hr (6 minute) 35/65 combo bolus. This allows my bolus to be given in 3 increments within 6 minutes, breaking it up into smaller doses...

[someone]

I have the Animas which apparently is notorious for bolus stings, but I don't have that problem. 1 unit per 3 seconds doesn't bother me at all unless I have the set in a bad spot and even then, it stops hurting after a few boluses.

I couldn't imagine waiting 20 minutes for a bolus. By the time my bolus was finished being delivered, I would be in the 500s. Ok, maybe not in the 500s, but the food would definately get a head start. If I want a 20 minute bolus on the Animas, I'll just do a combo/square wave bolus. ;)

[lolos]

But AFAIK, Animas gives the bolus in 1 unit increments. MM and Cozmo break it down into increments. So it is not only the speed but also the amount of insulin given at the time (increment vs. whole unit). For example, MM will give one unit as the following: .1, .1, .1, .1, .1, etc. Animas will give it as the following: 1 unit.

Please correct me if I am wrong. I am currently on the animas and will switch very soon to either Cozmo or MM due to the stinging bolus. I will probably go with the Cozmo.

[belyro]

But AFAIK, Animas gives the bolus in 1 unit increments. MM and Cozmo break it down into increments. So it is not only the speed but also the amount of insulin given at the time (increment vs. whole unit). For example, MM will give one unit as the following: .1, .1, .1, .1, .1, etc. Animas will give it as the following: 1 unit.

Please correct me if I am wrong. I am currently on the animas and will switch very soon to either Cozmo or MM due to the stinging bolus. I will probably go with the Cozmo.

MM does break it down into increments. I can't speak for the rest. Currently I only have problems with "stinging boluses" when the set needs to be changed. Otherwise I'm good now. I'm very happy with my MM.

[Glucoweb]

Not really stinging. On some sites, I have felt sore sometimes during a bolus. It feels almost like putting pressure on a bruise.