Daughter and dad going to "bootcamp"!

[Evermont]

Well, it's a "bootcamp like" exercise class I guess. It's 5:30am to 6:30am M-F thru May 5 to May 30. I don't think I'll need a haircut for this.

I've plateaued on my weight loss (though I do see some muscle popping out here and there...) so I figured this would be a fun way to kick things into high gear!

Let's see now, I'm paying some guy $5/hr to yell at me while I do calisthenics at 5:30 in the morning.
Hmmm... :hahaha: :geezmate: :argh:

[Penny]

I will do it for $4 an hour Keith....I will call evervy morning at 6:30 and yell at you, OK? :D I hope this helps you, it is frustrating to reach those weight loss plateaus.

[fgummett]

Good for you! Sounds like a great idea... especially getting family involved too :)

[Keezheekoni]

Congrats on the willingness to be yelled at for an hour a day! I don't know many men who will put up with that, unless they are getting paid for it! :D

Good on your daughter for doing it too.

[Evermont]

Actually, it's my daughter who twisted my arm. She signed up for the class first. She's a personal trainer at the same gym that "bootcamp Brian" works out of. I think he's the head trainer or something. I've been hearing about him for months and looking forward to meeting him. Might as well get a workout too.

LOL Penny, PM me your resume and I'll consider your kind offer.

[fgummett]

Having been married (and divorced) twice, I'm tempted to say, "I thought being yelled at for an hour was just par for the course as a man"... Of course I fully realise that it is all my fault... whatever it is :D

[Scratch]

Well, it's a "bootcamp like" exercise class I guess. It's 5:30am to 6:30am M-F thru May 5 to May 30. I don't think I'll need a haircut for this.

I've plateaued on my weight loss (though I do see some muscle popping out here and there...) so I figured this would be a fun way to kick things into high gear!

Let's see now, I'm paying some guy $5/hr to yell at me while I do calisthenics at 5:30 in the morning.
Hmmm... :hahaha: :geezmate: :argh:
If there's something I've noticed it seems like there are often plateau type of periods. And changing things up a bit can be helpful to breaking the plateaus.

Unlike you though, my focus this year has been to put on some weight, hello squats and deadlifts, but of primary importance along with the choice of exercise is the diet. There's really no way to get around the diet, but something I observed with incorportating squats and deadlifts into my routine is it made it easier for me to want to adapt my diet -- I got hungrier especially for protein.

So perhaps if you put some time and focus in on metabolic conditioning type of exercising such as calesthentics, you'll find that your diet and wants for diet will adapt some to help bring your weight down some more.

[davef]

Keith,

Fair play to you, that's called dedication. $5/hour seems like a fairly good deal for personal attention. Bet it will really kick start your metabolism again. It's great you have the type of relatonship with your daugther that you can do something like this with her. My 11 year old daughter has been nagging me to go horse riding since I started losing weight, reckon I have another 15lbs to go before I could do it without getting in trouble with animal welfare people for cruelty to a horse!

Go for it, well done,

[Alice]

I loved my "four days" of bootcamp. Unfortunately I sustained a stress fracture from running on pavement...so don't push yourself more than you feel...I felt so great...I am not an early morning riser...so the 7 a.m. start time was bootcamp enough for me! (I can't even believe the 5:30 a.m. class had more attendees!)

These bootcamps are fun and seem to attract those of us who need a push...unfortunately for me...it was too much of a push. I'm going back to my situps, weights and walking at my own pace...but I did love bootcamp. Darn, I didn't even get the fun tee-shirt...

[owlyn]

Hey, I'll call you for free and yell at you!

[Evermont]

This is what bootcamp did for me last time I did it.

http://www.diabetesforums.com/gallery/files/9/0/7/7/KeithNavy83.jpg

It's gonna take more than a month of early morning push-ups and crunches to get those abs back, but that's my goal for 2008.

I was 19 or so in this pic. Tanned from exploring some of the 365 beaches on Antigua and spending time in other tropical places. I have a different latitude about tanning these days :cool2: more Vermont farmer style now. I was probably 170 lbs. there, I'm aiming for the same BF but with more muscle - 185 lbs. My pecs, lats quads and calves are already slightly bigger than this '83 version of me, gains from the past 6 months atop a flabby 44 year old physique with hidden potential.

[Scratch]

Here's a calisthentic workout to work your way towards, it's taken from Crossfit and it's called Murphy --

1. one mile run
2. 100 pull ups, 200 push ups, 300 air squats (just you squatting up and down).
3. again, a one mile run

You can break up the pull ups, push ups and squats into whatever order you want. When I did it last weekend, I did sets of 5-10-15 20x and that worked well for me.

I'd say that anyone who can get Murphy done is in reasonably decent shape, certainly in much better shape than the average population.

[Evermont]

Here's a calisthentic workout to work your way towards, it's taken from Crossfit and it's called Murphy --

1. one mile run
2. 100 pull ups, 200 push ups, 300 air squats (just you squatting up and down).
3. again, a one mile run

You can break up the pull ups, push ups and squats into whatever order you want. When I did it last weekend, I did sets of 5-10-15 20x and that worked well for me.

I'd say that anyone who can get Murphy done is in reasonably decent shape, certainly in much better shape than the average population.

Wow, yeah - that's a real workout there! I could certainly do it if I paced myself and made a day of it, but if I tried to hit all that in say 1 hour, I might need medical intervention (j/k). How much time should it take to complete this?

I like a good benchmark, I think I'll try this 2-3 days before bootcamp, then again after and see how long it takes and how it feels. Before and after photos and vital stats too.

...So perhaps if you put some time and focus in on metabolic conditioning type of exercising such as calesthentics, you'll find that your diet and wants for diet will adapt some to help bring your weight down some more.

I like some of the ideas in your earlier post too, thx Scratch.

[Scratch]

Wow, yeah - that's a real workout there! I could certainly do it if I paced myself and made a day of it, but if I tried to hit all that in say 1 hour, I might need medical intervention (j/k). How much time should it take to complete this?

I like a good benchmark, I think I'll try this 2-3 days before bootcamp, then again after and see how long it takes and how it feels. Before and after photos and vital stats too.



I like some of the ideas in your earlier post too, thx Scratch.
When I did it last weekend, it took me 58:31 to complete it. But I've been working pretty hard for a while to get ready to do something like it and I've had a lot of days in the past 3 months where I would end up doing triple digit numbers of pull ups and push ups. So I already knew I had the work capacity for it although I was a bit nervous that trying to do all of it at once I was potentially going to find myself tanking as it went on.

Probably a good way for you to get a measure on how ready you might be for it would to be do some death-by-exercise name sets. It's a pretty decent way to get an idea of things are going.

You need some sort of timer that'll go every minute.

If you're doing pull ups, at the start and minute 1, do 1 pull up. When the timer goes off and minute 2 starts, do 2 pull ups. At 3, do 3 pull ups. Keep going up until you reach a number that you can't do that number inside of the minute. So it just keeps building up and you lose recovery time as the minutes go by.

On 4-7, when I did death by pull ups, I was able to go 10 rounds + 8 pull ups, which is a total of 63 pull ups. For push ups, I got 13 rounds + 10 which was a total of 101 push ups.

And of course, always remember the idea of scaling, you know? While right now I may wish I could do squat workouts with 200 lbs or more on the bar, it wouldn't do me much good. So you might find it useful to scale Murph down to a half-Murph.

For me and where I am now, it was brutal. I didn't do any workouts the 2 days following Murphy, but I loved doing it. In some of the later rounds it began to feel like if I tried to do the squats too fast I was going to puke.

I don't really know where you're at for conditioning, so obviously I'm going to caution you a bit. Seriously try do a death-by-pull ups and push ups first to get a rough gauge on your work capacity. That can at least give you some idea of whether you have a decent chance to complete it in under an hour and I'd seriously suggest that if it looks like it would take you more than 60 minutes, scale it down to a level where you'd be able to finish inside of 60 minutes.

[Evermont]

I did my strength training in the garage yesterday as usual and then off on my walk. My walking shoes wore out long ago and I finally replaced them Saturday so my feet were pretty happy. Even with Riley on my back I reached the far point in my 4 mile loop but decided to keep going. Riley didn't seem to mind (he was asleep) so I did the 8 mile trek all the way to the town line!

The black flies and "no-see-ums" were starting to gather whenever the wind let up. Boy, that takes all the fun out of it. But we made it back with Riley taking only a couple minor dings - he got a little too much sun and somehow his ankle rubbed on something enough to cause a little sore. I was plenty tired, that was the first time I did that 8 miles walk with the extra 25 pounds on my back.

So I get home and my daughter tells me that boot camp starts in the morning, not next week like I thought?!?!? I wanted to do some fitness testing before and after - too late! I was up at 4:30 this morning getting ready. I got to the gym right at 5:30 and before I knew which was what I was doing 1950's style calisthenics in a basketball court with 26 women including my daughter, and two guys including our "drill sergeant" Brian.

It was nearly flat out for the entire hour - dozens of varied exercises more or less familiar. I kept up pretty well bat gladly coasted through a couple sets. I'll be up to speed in a week or so I guess and he says it will get progressively more challenging.

Daughter and I paired up for something called 'partner rows' where you take turns giving each other resistance while facing each other pulling a pole in a rowing motion. She's so light I was launching her off the ground so Brian teamed up with her and gave me a challenge. He didn't really yell at all, just skillfully talked the group through the hour calling out the count and giving instructions and advice. He demonstrated all the exercises and performed them with the class showing incredible fitness and stamina for an older guy (maybe in his mid 50's). I worked up a real good sweat - even my daughter who's in great shape herself was all red, sweaty and puffing for air.

I have access to a private shower at work. Ahh, life is good!

[Scratch]

I'm curious, what all were the array of exercises you did at boot camp?

I run my own private boot camp and I'm always on the lookout for ideas and information to try to put to good use.

[Evermont]

I'm curious, what all were the array of exercises you did at boot camp?

I run my own private boot camp and I'm always on the lookout for ideas and information to try to put to good use.

My daughter has the list, I'll post it when I get my hands on it. I'm sure she had a good reason for not making it to bootcamp this morning, she told me at the end of the first session yesterday that she wouldn't be there.

Turns out she wasn't the only one, we had less than half as many recruits today (12) as yesterday! I was still pretty sore in certain spots from day 1.

A few (maybe half) of the exercises from memory some with wrong names:
side straddle hops (jumping jacks to most folks)
walking lunges
pushups
grapevines
true jumping jacks (hands on the floor to jump with arms raised)
hopping knee ups
burpees
side-center-side squats
picking up bananas
Davinci's
steam engines
twisting pushups
squat/bends
partner rows
8 count squat thrusts
brushing the floor lunge kicks
4 count V-ups
crunches (till the cows come home)
run/jump/shuffle left-right/turn
side planks
prone plank
variety of stretches

[Scratch]

My daughter has the list, I'll post it when I get my hands on it. I'm sure she had a good reason for not making it to bootcamp this morning, she told me at the end of the first session yesterday that she wouldn't be there.

Turns out she wasn't the only one, we had less than half as many recruits today (12) as yesterday! I was still pretty sore in certain spots from day 1.



That's not surprising, I would expect many to be sore, especially if they're starting up from a sedentary lifestyle. I remember that when I started my path to getting shape by walking and golfing 18 holes using a pullcart to tote my clubs around that early on I was often sore the next day.

It'll be interesting to see if more come back the next day, if it remains steady, or if the number will continue to decline.

[Evermont]

Today, day 3, the headcount was 28! dd says that many folks do Mon-Wed-Fri instead of 5 days straight. OK, but I'm trying not to miss a single day. She did have a good reason for skipping Tuesday, she has ballet on Monday night which is on until 10p.m. after the drive home and shower she'd be down to 3.5 hours of sleep before bootcamp. Ouch.

Well, I was pretty sore after day 1. More so after day 2. I wasn't sure if I could keep up this pace but today actually seemed a bit easier! Our "drill Sargent" is slowly adding more reps and a new exercise here and there so it is progressing but slowly enough.

Here's the complete list:
Side Straddle Hops - 50
Hindu Squats - 10
John Henrys - 10
Jumping Jacks - 10
Push Ups - 10

Burpees - 10
Walking Lunges/Jog Back - 20
Grapevine
Partner Rows - 10
Davincis - 10

Squat Kicks - 20
Picking Bananas
Steam Engines - 20
Rabbit Hops - 10
4-Count V-Ups - 10

Hopping Knee Lifts - 20
Squat Reach-unders - 10
Hinge Pushups - 10
Brush The Floor - 10/10
Run and Drop
Bicycles - 20

3-Way Squats - 10
Jog Jump Side Shuffle
8 Count Squat Thrusts - 8
Clock Lunges - 20
Mountain Climbers - 20

Stretching

[Alice]

I must be getting old...jumping jacks is about the only exercise I'm recognizing on your list! The names are fun! I love basic exercises...I burned out with aerobics and running...sounds like you are in a good program!

[Evermont]

I must be getting old...jumping jacks is about the only exercise I'm recognizing on your list! The names are fun! I love basic exercises...I burned out with aerobics and running...sounds like you are in a good program!

Well Alice, I hate to break this to you... yes, we are both getting old, but consider the alternative! Speaking of old, I figured our drill Sargent was in his mid 50's, turns out he's in his mid 60's! This guy is something else - more about him later.

He says that these exercises are straight out of a 1950's US Army training manual. Many of the names threw me off too. Jumping Jacks are not what you think. What many call jumping jacks here are called "side straddle hops", a name I have heard before - probably the first time I did (real) bootcamp. The jumping jacks in this list are like this:
Start in standing position. Bend at the knees placing both hands on the floor (think like a frog). Leap straight up into the air raising arms overhead. Repeat.

[Evermont]

Day 4, 16 heads. The M-W-F model seems to be holding up. I'm guessing Friday will be a little slower though - maybe 20.

From one day to the next we do the same routine. Variety is something I really value but I expected this kind of thing. Repetition is part and parcel of almost any exercise it seems. I mean, even when I'm exercising solo, I still have to do reps. Bootcamp to me is about reps of each exercise which we would all expect, but also it's the same exercises every day, in the same order, in the same room, with the same people, at the same cadence, at the same time of day, etc. etc.

Drill Sargent (DS) offers some variations of some exercise which accommodate varying fitness levels, an appropriate bit of flexibility which I recall being absent from my experiences with the uniformed services. I also notice DS doing little extras on his own, like adding a leap at the end of an exercise, or a full twisting leap, or some other flourish which he seems not to expect any of us 'recruits' to do but I don't think he's showing off either, that would be out of character. He's just getting himself a little extra workout 'cause bootcamp is just too easy for him.

Today I was asked to provide my shirt size. We all know what that means!! It means I payed for a T-shirt with my fee. Woohoo! :biggrin:

DD works at the gym, so she talks with DS almost daily. I guess they talked about my mini-rebellion yesterday. Picking Bananas just seemed wrong to me - it's a gorilla emulation, we shuffle sideways across the gym reaching down to the ground with both hands on some steps, then coming back up-right and beating the chest on other steps. Well, I happen to know that bananas grow on trees so I modified the exercise to reach up instead of down. Gee, that makes it a little easier too :T . Well, DS said nothing yesterday but today, before we did the exercise he explained that the exercise comes from some professional basketball routine (so not all exercises come from the 1950's Army manual) and that DS knows that bananas grow on trees because he used to pick bananas in Hawaii and it was the hardest job he ever had. Coming from this guy, that means a lot. But he pointed out the correct form for the exercise. Never singled me out. Such a diplomat! I'm impressed with that as much as anything else.

[Alice]

By any chance is this part of the franchise of "Adventure Bootcamps?"...that is the group I joined in my local area. I had thought they would meet at the beach...which they did...only we stayed in the parking lot! I would have enjoyed running relays and such on the beach...I only lasted 4 days...so it really didn't matter. But, I really enjoyed the "challenge".

[Evermont]

By any chance is this part of the franchise of "Adventure Bootcamps?"...that is the group I joined in my local area. I had thought they would meet at the beach...which they did...only we stayed in the parking lot! I would have enjoyed running relays and such on the beach...I only lasted 4 days...so it really didn't matter. But, I really enjoyed the "challenge".

No Alice, this is just a "bootcamp style" exercise class offered by a local outfit. They have 5 locations near me and that's all. They offer this class probably because this particular "master trainer" (a.k.a 'DS') deems it worthwhile. So far we've had 4 straight days of rain or cold (it snowed lightly yesterday) so it's all in a gym so far, but when the weather improves, we'll be at park down the street a few blocks. I'm looking forward to that.

[Evermont]

...I'm guessing Friday will be a little slower though - maybe 20...

I called it - 20 heads today exactly.

Just another day at the office (gym) today, it's becoming quite routine now. There were a few moments of "wow, this is hard!" but less than previous days. The hour went quickly and was over before I knew it. We added "alligator walk" today and increased the reps on a few exercises. The hopping knee lifts, one of my least favorites, was modified to become "traveling hopping knee lifts". It's a very Jane Fonda / cheerleader type of movement. Your basically skipping in place lifting alternating knees as high as possible while raising arms up and then down quickly so that your hands come down on either side of the lifted knee at it's highest point. I think we need some YouTUBE video to illustrate. The traveling variation was sideways back and forth across the gym.

Since I'm not a total wreck now after the first week of bootcamp I think I'll work my upper body and especially biceps later today and again on Sunday. They're feeling a little left out. I'm gonna start to do more regular stretching also - I can see now how badly I need it. I'll take Riley for a nice long sunset walk tonight too - he likes that and I get 4 miles with 25 lbs on my back in the bargain!

[Evermont]

28 heads today including 2 very young girls, one in a pink forearm cast.

Business as usual at bootcamp, just added a few reps here and there. The hour went quickly.

Last night I set out for the 4 mile sunset walk with Riley, the clouds were clearing as a high moved through. It felt good and I was really looking forward to a nice sunset. I don't know what got into Riley though, he started getting mad at me so I had to turn around at like 1/3 of the trip and take him back home. I hope it was just a fluke. I can't wait 'till the little guy can tell me what's up so I can make it right.

[Evermont]

Started with 12 heads today, stragglers brought it up to 15. DD is going to miss every Tuesday due to ballet past 10pm every Monday.

I'll post here again if anything interesting happens but this is becoming so routine that there seems little point to posting daily.

DS mentioned one thing though that may be worth passing on here. He says that perfecting technique on these exercises presents a lot of opportunity to increase the difficulty level, and the payoff for doing them. It's entirely too easy to cheat. To squat less deeply than you should, to lunge half way, to jump less high, to fail to get full extension on the stretches, etc. This is a good take-away for me. I'll try to maintain or improve technique long-term.

[Scratch]

Started with 12 heads today, stragglers brought it up to 15. DD is going to miss every Tuesday due to ballet past 10pm every Monday.

I'll post here again if anything interesting happens but this is becoming so routine that there seems little point to posting daily.

DS mentioned one thing though that may be worth passing on here. He says that perfecting technique on these exercises presents a lot of opportunity to increase the difficulty level, and the payoff for doing them. It's entirely too easy to cheat. To squat less deeply than you should, to lunge half way, to jump less high, to fail to get full extension on the stretches, etc. This is a good take-away for me. I'll try to maintain or improve technique long-term.
Yeah, it's often good to work on doing everything with proper form. There can be exceptions in some situations, but by and large, proper form is important.

I think bodyweight calisthentics are an excellent way for people to learn form and start strength training. If you think about it, the most basic necessary form of strength and fitness is being able to manuever your own body and its weight in space. I think starting there with bodyweight training is ideal for beginning the nervous system training of strength, not many people are aware the nervous system is hugely important in getting strong, the nervous system needs to learn how to coordinate the available muscle fiber to accomplish the task. So there's a lot of good happening when a person uses bodyweight exercises that involve the person becoming aware of how the body is coordinated in space and movement -- something that is lacking in many machine exercises and other isolation type of work.

That's my way of saying push ups beat the unliving crud out of a bowflex bench press.

[Evermont]

You make some really good points here Scratch (I'm starting to expect that from you). I really like the way you express these ideas.

I think that machines have their place, for example, DD uses a big fancy Cybex thingie to do "assisted pull-ups". She's cutting back more and more on the level of assist while building enough upper body strength ultimately to do regular unassisted pull-ups. There are other examples. I suppose a pull-up bar is the minimal equipment to work the biceps. Free weights allow a bit more flexibility wrt weight and reps. I really like my TotalGym for curls, it uses body weight but has adjustable incline too. Hard to do that with just a pull-up bar.

I see what you mean though about the isolation on specific muscles that machines tend to embody. You lose something important there. Compound movement is part of it, but the nervous system aspect is another important element.

A lot of people get sucked into the glitzy bowflexy commercials and buy expensive equipment with the idea that the machine will make them fit. The trick is not just to purchase the machine, but to actually use it! I know because a few years later the unused machine will be on Craigslist.org where we can buy it real cheap if not free! See for yourself.

I especially like the old-school simplicity of calisthenics. You don't need much if any gear to do them. Just gravity and your body - both of which are often available and low cost.

I look forward to my ultimate fitness 'situation'. Not a routine per se, because I value variety. I'll have some equipment exercises, a number of calisthenics, a library of stretches to dip into, balance techniques, strength training, various forms of cardio, walking, hiking, golf, snowboarding, etc. etc. I'm well on my way.

I'm looking at fitness beyond just keeping my A1c's low. I was out to live a long healthy life before Dx. Diabetes doesn't really change anything about that, it just adds some motivation is all. Ideas such as; losing body fat helps with insulin resistance, or strength training builds muscle which helps burn fat even at rest... These are useful ideas for sure. However, being fit in general is a superior perspective I think, it embodies those other ideas but goes far beyond them.

I'm a person who wants to stay fit first, a diabetic in good control second. They are compatible but one is a subset of the other.

[Evermont]

Overall attendance continues as before. Yesterday DS pointed out my "perfect attendance". I told him how it wouldn't make sense to pay for the class and not show up. Though the last few days I've been arriving just in time for the start. I counted 7 other people on the roster with full attendance.

DS says that bootcamp style classes are catching on I guess in the US, they're now featured on fitness mag covers and such. There was some study or something (real specific huh) saying that this type of class is more effective than most alternatives. The one other thing that is on par with bootcamp is food journaling (which leads to better food decision making).

I did the journaling when I started out with D, but once I got things under control I let up. Looks like I might want to go back to it. Effectiveness rules!

Today was the half way point. 2 weeks done, 2 weeks to go. My knee has a little hitch in it since Tuesday so I'm taking it easy on things that would aggravate it. Still it's a killer 1 hour workout. Sweat was just running off of me today. I felt good doing it, and I feel good after.

DW and DD both agree that I'm looking just a little thinner. The scale says I'm down just one pound since the start of bootcamp, but I know there's more muscles popping out here and there. I can feel some good things happening already. As slight as it is, it's nice.

DD had me do the BF% on a fancy portable machine they have at the gym. 26.2%. I can only wonder what it would have said two weeks ago - and 9 months ago when I started getting healthier. For comparison, my fancy bathroom scale wit BF% capability registered 32.4 today. So I guess the real answer is somewhere in the range between the two. She says that I'm about average (in todays fat USA) for men. Says 10% is a fairly aggressive goal 15% is fine. I think a good goal for me might be 12.5% average of the two devices by years end. I wonder how that compares to my weight goal of 185 by years end. It depends on a number of things including how well I build muscle.

I think I want to study up on creatine. Because I'm vegetarian and the creatinine trend on my last few blood tests... I might want to look into supplementation. Normally I don't supplement anything and generally prefer it that way but this may be an issue worthy of consideration.