Low energy

[Rekarb]

Diabetes is annoying!!!
I'm sitting here writing and I am totally exhausted! The lower carb diet did help to bring down my bg's but I can barely get off the couch right now. My energy comes and goes. One minute I'll feel fine the next I'm like this.

At first, I thought this was just due to my bg's dropping and after a few weeks I would feel fine. This didn't happen.
If I increase my carbs, my energy level goes up but so do my bg spikes. The good thing is that they do come back down. I just saw my endo and all he really had to say was "Don't starve yourself." This is his reaction to the fact that I've lost about 10 lbs over the last 3 months.
I really don't see what I can do about that. I've changed my diet all around in that time but my activity level has actually gone up. My weight was largely held up by starches with those out of my diet I had to expect some losses initially.

So I'm figuring I'm going to be increasing my carb intake to see if I can get my energy levels up.

Mike

PS Thanks to all of you who have helped me with my ADM research. I've still have oodles of info to digest.

[foxl]

Mike are you exercising? That is what gives me more energy ... honest! :D

[fgummett]

What are you eating..? You don't need to starve yourself to eat low-carb. Low-carb does not need to mean low-calorie.

[Rekarb]

Yep, I exercise. I get around on a bicycle so excercise is just a daily part of my life. That's one of the problems for me. My carbs don't seem to be enough right now to match my energy expenditure. Of course, years of cycling has given me the metabolism of a crazed rat.
I'm eating like crazy now so I have a full stomach, I just don't feel very good without a goodly amount of carbs. The thing is I've so radically changed my diet that when I want to supplement my meals with some carbs, there really isn't too much of that stuff around.

I'm still dithering with this diet thing so I keep making adjustments. I'm thinking that I need to find foods that have enough carbs but hit the body slowly so I can have sustained energy.

My carb counts were beneath 40 but I'm finding that I probably need to double that.

Mike

[dbc]

I'm still dithering with this diet thing so I keep making adjustments. I'm thinking that I need to find foods that have enough carbs but hit the body slowly so I can have sustained energy.

My carb counts were beneath 40 but I'm finding that I probably need to double that.


I also lo-carbed quite seriously initially, also ended up losing a bit of weight - can't say I noticed much of an energy problem though....

I've now relaxed the lo carb thing somewhat, probably average around 80g carb/day of low-GI carbs these days (but have just had a slice of milktart with morning coffee, which was seriously good!!)

It's interesting how differently we experience the lo-carb thing. I've had many people comment on my diet along the lines of "where do you get your energy from?", but I have never discerned it to be a problem. I guess you should experiment with increasing your carb intake to try find an acceptable balance between energy levels BG spikes. After all, it's got to be what works for you. . .

Dave

[NoraWI]

My suggestion would be to increase your *good* fat intake and not the carbs. Fat slows down the digestion and has double the calories of carbs. My suggestion would be to include avocados in your salads, cheese, and nuts for starters.

[dbc]

...... I meant to add - I also do a fair amount of exercise, jogging and cycling. . . .

[ant hill]

Hello Mike, Yes Diabetes is very annoying and you must feel defeated as you waste your body to the couch. You are in need of energy and to get that is insulin and slow releasing carbs that will last the day. You need more insulin as that will have the BG's to a better level and keep the exercise too Mike. Strike a better balance with Food & Insulin as that will give you Energy!!! :D

Look at the Basel (Your long acting Insulin) as that will gain better control and smooth the spikes. You will get some spikes but not that much.

[Rekarb]

Well, I don't take insulin so that's out but I'm better today because I've upped my carbs. Right now I'm not worried about healthy. I just need to find something that works consistently. Today, its been eating headcheese sandwiches. I figure the fat will slow down the carb uptake so I shouldn't spike but I should have some energy. So far, so good.

I think part of my problem is how I lived. For 20 years, I use to commute close to 18 miles a day by bike through city traffic and then work a full day. This took a lot of food and a good deal of that was carbs. The joke at work was that I had to eat my body weight everyday. I was a legend for the amount of food I consumed. Maybe I'm adapted to a certain amount of carbs. Whether this is the case or not, it does seem that I need more carbs than I've been taking in.

[princesslinda]

Mike, just a thought (from somebody who types urology office visits 8 hrs a day)...have you had your testosterone level checked lately? Insulin resistance can have an effect on this.

Anytime I hear a diabetic male complain of "low energy," that's one of the first things that comes to mind.

[tealas]

Mike,

I had very similar reactions when I shifted my diet to be 75% raw and lower carb. The first 2-3 months I was very spacey, and I noticed that when my blood sugar would go back up above 130-140mg/dl, I would feel more "normal".

About two months into it, I found out about green smoothies and found I could eat more fruit blended with a bunch of greens (spinch, kale, chard, dandelion greens - it is important to keep a variety). So I started getting more carbs, but when blended with the fiber, cholorphyll, vitamins and minerals of the greens, it really keeps my blood sugars balanced. My blood sugars sometimes go down alittle after I drink them, and I have never seen them over 120mg/dl afterwards even though they have 1-2 fruit exchanges. I also make my own treats (ground nuts "truffle" balls) that have agave syrup for afternoon snacks, and eat some starchy vegetables (cooked or raw) at lunch or dinner.

My energy is slowly getting more even as my body adapts to primarily getting carbs from better sources for me (i.e. better sources than the "Neolithic foods" - grains, potoatos & legumes). But I think this process may require a long adjustment time - months or even up to a few years.

Good luck, I know that feeling when your body isn't quite getting what it needs and you're trying to figure it out, but keep your blood sugars in range too!

-Teala

[Rekarb]

Thanks Teala

You know exactly what I'm talking about but do I have to feel like this for months? And why should that be the case for sooo long?

I've been feeling better now that I'm boosting my carbs and I read what you've been writing about the green smoothies but frankly it sounds really terrible. I've changed my diet considerably over the last few months and my taste buds and stomach are in slight rebellion. Where's the Udon noodles, pasta and that delicious syrup they lavish on pancakes up the street? They are not happy campers and a green smoothie might make them storm castle.

Uneasily wearing the crown
Mike

[lorilei]

Mike..sounds like you have your answer..maybe you respond best to weaning your self off of the high carb intake..even non-d's can get really out there mentally doing an atkins thing..for many of us, carbs aren't much use re: energy unless we can access them with insulin..so maybe you need to rethink your plan...just not sure..your experience is kind of the opposite of mine regarding carb reduction...good luck..maybe nancy has a point there with resistance..

[cyberus]

Umm ... I missed this thread before but ...

... there is a thing amongst low carbers called "induction flu" that happens to some people when they shift from normal/high carb diet to a very low carb diet. Low energy and flu-like symptoms are part of it and are reported to taper off and go away as you adapt. Some people can't stay on very low carb however because they just can't seem to shake the effect.

[Chef Barrae]

Diabetes is annoying!!!
I'm sitting here writing and I am totally exhausted! The lower carb diet did help to bring down my bg's but I can barely get off the couch right now. My energy comes and goes. One minute I'll feel fine the next I'm like this.

At first, I thought this was just due to my bg's dropping and after a few weeks I would feel fine. This didn't happen.
If I increase my carbs, my energy level goes up but so do my bg spikes. The good thing is that they do come back down. I just saw my endo and all he really had to say was "Don't starve yourself." This is his reaction to the fact that I've lost about 10 lbs over the last 3 months.
I really don't see what I can do about that. I've changed my diet all around in that time but my activity level has actually gone up. My weight was largely held up by starches with those out of my diet I had to expect some losses initially.

So I'm figuring I'm going to be increasing my carb intake to see if I can get my energy levels up.

Mike

PS Thanks to all of you who have helped me with my ADM research. I've still have oodles of info to digest.

Mike, how low is low-carb for you? Maybe if you have something like whole-wheat pasta or any of the other nutritionally enriched pasta it might help. You'll eat a little more carbs but the fiber in it helps slow digestion. You'll still be eating the calories for energy as well. Take a look at the glycemis index and pick some foods that are low on the scale with carbs. Test, test, test to make sure that each new food doesn't spike you. This way, you can find more foods to eat with better or good carbs. Don't forget about the fiber. Eat lots with your carbs to slow digestion.

[Rekarb]

My endo is pretty convinced that IR isn't an issue here. He considers me to be an athlete. My BMI points away from that as well. Like I've said before, all my tests show that I'm in the peak of health except for that little blood sugar problem. They don't call this "Atypical Diabetes" for nothing!

I went at the carbs with a vengeance. If it spiked my bg - it was gone. I quickly got down below 40 carbs a day and sometimes wouldn't go passed 20. At this time, the meds had yet to work so exercise and diet was all I had.

I was hungry then but not overly tired even though I had dropped close to ten pounds. It was after the meds kicked in and my bgs began to drop that I started running out of gas. I figured this was due to false hypos but it didn't stop. One minute -fine, the next - exhausted. I started adding back in carbs about a week ago and it has started to let up. Slowly, I'm getting my energy back and it correlated with me increasing my carbs. I'm not spiking either so I'm seeing that I have to have at least 60 carbs a day or I feel lousy.

So we are going to see how it goes.

Mike

[foxl]

Mike, what about Actos ... ? Could it be causing the fatigue?

[Rekarb]

Linda

The fatigue didn't start until the Actos kicked in so it certainly is playing a part. But you have to figure that anything that lowers blood glucose has to be something of a drain. I really wonder about how this drug works. I know what the literature says but frankly a shot of whiskey seems to lower my bg faster and with less side effects then this stuff.
Right now I'm in the situation of taking in more carbs to offset the fatigue. I am more ready than ever to go on insulin and drop this drug.

Mike

[HuskerMychal]

Mike,
I know Linda touched on it earlier but has your endo checked your T levels? There is a couple threads on DF about low testosterone and D.

[foxl]

Linda

The fatigue didn't start until the Actos kicked in so it certainly is playing a part. But you have to figure that anything that lowers blood glucose has to be something of a drain. I really wonder about how this drug works. I know what the literature says but frankly a shot of whiskey seems to lower my bg faster and with less side effects then this stuff.
Right now I'm in the situation of taking in more carbs to offset the fatigue. I am more ready than ever to go on insulin and drop this drug.

Mike

Mike, I would get call your MD and get off it, ask for something else, your choice. It did not affect me that way, in fact I had no obvious side effects, but I am just as glad to be rid of it.

I think there is more to it than lower blood sugar -- I actually feel BETTER, lower, and more energetic.

[tealas]

Linda

The fatigue didn't start until the Actos kicked in so it certainly is playing a part. But you have to figure that anything that lowers blood glucose has to be something of a drain. I really wonder about how this drug works. I know what the literature says but frankly a shot of whiskey seems to lower my bg faster and with less side effects then this stuff.
Right now I'm in the situation of taking in more carbs to offset the fatigue. I am more ready than ever to go on insulin and drop this drug.

Mike

Why are you taking Actos if the Endo doesn't think you have IR?

I would bail on Actos and try only Metformin for awhile before you head towards insulin. You seemed to have good experience with Met previously right?

And sorrry when I responded the other day, I wasn't aware you had started medications! Last we were talking you were just doing diet and exercise....

[tealas]

Thanks Teala

You know exactly what I'm talking about but do I have to feel like this for months? And why should that be the case for sooo long?

I've been feeling better now that I'm boosting my carbs and I read what you've been writing about the green smoothies but frankly it sounds really terrible. I've changed my diet considerably over the last few months and my taste buds and stomach are in slight rebellion. Where's the Udon noodles, pasta and that delicious syrup they lavish on pancakes up the street? They are not happy campers and a green smoothie might make them storm castle.

Uneasily wearing the crown
Mike

All I can say Mike is that I feel so much better when I drink green smoothies, so much more balanced, and have less cravings that I don't care how green they look or how yucky they "sound". S'ok, you don't need to try the green smoothies... leaves more fresh greens available for me to consume :D

My first 2 months were the worst, and were before I discovered how to make green smoothies. But when I started them, they really helped even out the low-blood sugar "flu" type & spacey symptoms! And I felt that way just bringing my HbA1c down from 6.1 to 5.8 - and you were up there in the 9's.

It really isn't unreasonable to expect a few months or even a year of transition when we may have had high blood sugars going on for 5 years, 10 years or longer!? I don't know how I walked around with my blood sugars spiking up around 160-200mg/dl after lunch and dinner for years. Now that I am coming down below 120 most of the time, when it goes back up that high I feel awful!

[Rekarb]

Okay, you broke me down and I actually made one. It was very good! I'm a convert. It spiked my bg way up though. I'll have to do some experimentation to get it to work better but I don't see that as a problem.

Met didn't work for me until I was given the Actos with it. My endo believes that, given time, I won't feel tired then the whole question will be how it's working over time. I'm still doing the 120 to 150 thing even with low carbs. Of course, my exercise has fallen off due to the lack of energy. As my energy returns though I'm going back to being my active self. Once again, I'll wait and see.

Mike

[tealas]

Okay, you broke me down and I actually made one. It was very good! I'm a convert. It spiked my bg way up though. I'll have to do some experimentation to get it to work better but I don't see that as a problem.

Met didn't work for me until I was given the Actos with it. My endo believes that, given time, I won't feel tired then the whole question will be how it's working over time. I'm still doing the 120 to 150 thing even with low carbs. Of course, my exercise has fallen off due to the lack of energy. As my energy returns though I'm going back to being my active self. Once again, I'll wait and see.

Mike

Mike,

I'm so glad you gave it a try! And thanks for letting me (us) know. I hope they help you in your efforts, but we all must experiement with what works for our own bodies.

When I first started the green smoothies, if I had a lot of high glycemic index fruit in them, and I ate them later in the day (my personal worst time of day for blood sugar control), I did see a couple of spikes. But after several months now, I really haven't seen anything much over 120. I watch the ratio of fruits to greens and also try different fruits that will hit a little slower. For a long time I just did spinach (2-3 cups packed spinach leaves) with 2 cups water, one medium size apple and about 1/2 banana. The other thing I use frequently in the smoothies is chia seeds. This makes it more of a "pudding", but the soluable fiber in chia is very good for the digestive track and moderating absorption of the fruit sugar. The other factor is that the quality of blender may effect how well the greens get broken up.

I really recommend Victoria Boutenkos book "Green for Life" - there is so much good information in there and it fills in many reasons why green smoothies can help support our health!

Cheers,
Teala