Student Writer Wanting to Know about Diabetes

[pressdarlings]

I am working on a short piece of fiction and researching.

There is a character who is ashamed of having diabetes and hides it well (reader doesn't know this). But one of the characters (character X) finds out about this and thinks she's shooting heroin (so do the readers).

So basically, for people to believe this...I have a few questions.

Can insulin be shot into veins? Would a tourniquet be required for someone who can't hit any arteries? Or are arms popular areas to shoot insulin into? How would someone be able to confuse this?

Thank you.

[plattb1]

Insulin is injected subcutaneously (into the muscle). No tourniquet required. Back of arms are sometimes used, but more commonly, outside of thighs & tummy area.

It would defy common sense to mistake one for the other.

[jdliquidfire]

As a type 1 user, I was taught insulin was injected subcutaneously into fat. This slows the absorption of the insulin, shooting it into muscle would allow it to be absorbed far too quickly. Tummy, back of arms, buttocks are areas where it would be difficult to impossible to hit veins or muscle.

I have no idea how taking insulin could be mistaken for heroin use. Possibly the needle marks, but they would be taken in very different areas so this would probably only be possible to the uninformed.

[fgummett]

I could perhaps see how having the paraphernalia of syringes, needles and such-like may be confused by the uninitiated, someone might jump to conclusions... sneaking off to the bathroom with a syringe perhaps?

[notme]

That is correct liquid.

Here is the definition for subcutaneous injection. "That term means beneath the skin and refers to the connective tissues and adipose tissues that are between the skin and above the muscles".

I suppose someone who is not familiar with diabetes would mistake anyone giving an injection in their arm or stomach as possible drug use. But honestly, that would be a stretch. An elastic band is not used, the needles are tiny and only are long enough for subcutaneous injection.

[DeusXM]

Many people who inject insulin don't even use syringes. They use insulin pens which look very sanitary and are barely recognisable as something to inject stuff.

Also, no-one with diabetes would mainline insulin into a vein like a heroin addict would take smack. Mainlining insulin would most probably kill someone in a matter of minutes. There is certainly no need to use a tourniquet.

Most people with diabetes who inject insulin also inject into their thighs, stomach or buttocks, rather than their arms. The process is also very quick and doesn't require a massive amount of preparation.

Put it this way, I could be sat at the table having dinner with you and talking - and you wouldn't even notice if I was injecting insulin at the same time.

As someone else who's been a creative writing student and someone with diabetes, I urge you to find another plot angle. The story doesn't hold together in terms of plot and the only way it could hold together is by perpetuating negative misinformation.

[matingara]

As someone else who's been a creative writing student and someone with diabetes, I urge you to find another plot angle. The story doesn't hold together in terms of plot and the only way it could hold together is by perpetuating negative misinformation.

tell that to Hollywood. they made an entire movie that perpetuated terrible mistruths about diabetes. i forget what it was called but it was a real sham and had some "big name" actors in it too...

:)

-- joel.

[DeusXM]

Panic Room and Con Air spring to mind...

[Subby]

Hey, I've had someone mistake me for shooting up. In a shop, it was in my belly, but they looked at me horrified, and reacted like they had been busted by dropping all manner of druggy things and running out the door (were a drug dealer plying trade, from the looks of it). I assume they were extremely jumpy or paranoid or high... but there you go. It can happen.

Syringes have not at all disappeared, it is not a stretch to use a syringe. Some people do inject into arms, but not enough to avoid that seeming a contrived choice. I would agree it would need to be through less direct routes (such as finding syringes) if this was somehow to be carried off.

I did understand though, that druggies shoot up through u100 needles such as are available for diabetics. Such was explained to me by a pharmacist when I tried to buy needles once (in the dodgy part of town).


As someone else who's been a creative writing student and someone with diabetes, I urge you to find another plot angle. The story doesn't hold together in terms of plot and the only way it could hold together is by perpetuating negative misinformation.

I think a writer needs to make their own decisions about they want to write about, and I must say the theme of secrecy allows for a great deal of misunderstanding.Through exploring something like this (well), I can see a number of thought provoking themes potentially coming to light. It could quite powerfully teach the reader not to jump to assumptions when they look at a diabetic or see a syringe. That said I agree more research and probably modification of the plot would be in order.

[matingara]

Panic Room and Con Air spring to mind...

no they don't. well not to my mind anyway... i assume those are movies?

[Moonglo]

Syringes have not at all disappeared, it is not a stretch to use a syringe. Some people do inject into arms, but not enough to avoid that seeming a contrived choice. I would agree it would need to be through less direct routes (such as finding syringes) if this was somehow to be carried off.

I did understand though, that druggies shoot up through u100 needles such as are available for diabetics. Such was explained to me by a pharmacist when I tried to buy needles once (in the dodgy part of town).



I think a writer needs to make their own decisions about they want to write about, and I must say the theme of secrecy allows for a great deal of misunderstanding.Through exploring something like this (well), I can see a number of thought provoking themes potentially coming to light. It could quite powerfully teach the reader not to jump to assumptions when they look at a diabetic or see a syringe. That said I agree more research and probably modification of the plot would be in order.


As a sister of a recovering heroin addict, I can confirm that some heroin users definitely DO get their needles/syringes from pharmacies. In fact, I have heard that syringes and needles are one of the highest-theft non-medicine items that pharmacies carry. They are also apparently more likely to be bought with counterfeit money, since the cost is relatively low compared with other items the pharmacy sells and cashiers are less likely to check authenticity of smaller bills. I know that sounds far fetched, but my sister was actually involved in a counterfeit ring while she was at her worst, so I have seen the effects of this very behavior.

And I tend to agree with Subby. I can see someone who doesn't know anything about diabetes misunderstanding when they find needles and such. I too doubt that diabetics behave the same way that addicts do when about to shoot up, just because injecting insulin goes much quicker and does not leave the person wanting to sit around and enjoy the effects the way heroin would (my sister disappeared for 45 minutes the night of my bachelorette party; turns out she was in the bathroom the entire time enjoying her high). Nonetheless, I think the plot has potential if, as others have suggested, the details were modified. And, as someone who knows just how little the rest of the world knows about diabetes, I say this could be a wonderful way to help non-diabetic readers understand us a little better. Just my two cents :)

[Moonglo]

no they don't. well not to my mind anyway... i assume those are movies?

Yep. Panic Room is about a family that uses the panic room in their home to hide from an intruder (if I remember correctly, the intruder spends a good portion of the movie trying to break into the panic room). I don't remember much of Con Air, but it's a movie as well.

[gettingby]

tell that to Hollywood. they made an entire movie that perpetuated terrible mistruths about diabetes. i forget what it was called but it was a real sham and had some "big name" actors in it too...

:)

-- joel.

Panic Room and Con Air spring to mind...

I had forgotten about Panic Room. The one movie that springs to mind for me was Steel Magnolias. It had a couple big names in it (Julia Roberts and Sally Field).

[Mich]

I just had to chime in on the subject of insulin pens.

Here in the US, many insurance companies including my own deny coverage for insulin pens unless you are either partially blind (count "clicks") or a K-12 student who must inject at school. In these cases, a prior-authorization is required and it must be frequently renewed by your doctor.

Yes, another case of good decision-making on the part of some American Health Insurance companies. Pens help people manage more easily and for this reason, are covered in most countries with government-run health care.

To Pressdarlings: I too would prefer a different plot. This one is so old, we diabetics even joke with each other about it. Out loud. In public. ;)

I do like your idea of a person hiding or denying having diabetes. It happens only too often and causes great harm both medically and socially. That alone could morph intoo some great interpersonal situations. We could use some good writing in this area!

Mich

[andypoo]

tell that to Hollywood. they made an entire movie that perpetuated terrible mistruths about diabetes. i forget what it was called but it was a real sham and had some "big name" actors in it too...

:)

-- joel.

Panic Room and Con Air spring to mind...

I agree wholeheartedly with you guys, If I recall in the Panic Room,I got really ticked off about it,because the little girl was having a severe insulin reaction,she needed sugar not More insulin! As far as someone mistakenly thinking a person is injecting drugs when they're injecting insulin is just ludicrous! Maybe in archaic times,that could've appeared that way, as I understand the syringes and needles first used were huge and horribly painful,and the poor diabetic practically had to starve themselves to death. We've come a long way from that,thank goodness and medical research! I don't recall Con Air,what misinformation did that have in it?

[Grunch]

because the little girl was having a severe insulin reaction,she needed sugar not More insulin!

You can't know that she was low, maybe she was going into DKA and needed insulin. In Con Air it was the same thing, one of the prisoners needed insulin.

[Subby]

To Pressdarlings: I too would prefer a different plot. This one is so old, we diabetics even joke with each other about it. Out loud. In public. ;)

This is so true Mich... it's the oldest joke in the diabetic's book, that's for sure. But I never saw it treated well on paper... it is either the masochist, or the eternal optimist in me, that would like to see a really well done, gripping yarn on this topic. I can't work out which... :)

[soso]

OK..I agree about most normal people not mistaking insulin use for heroin use...however I have had peoples eyes widen in disbelief (never asked why) and I think it was on this forum but maybe not, where somebody posted that a woman in a restaurant smacked the needle out of her hand and across the floor and said "not in here you don't!".. so clearly it does happen...


Here is my two pennorth..

Shamed Diabetic in toilet cubicle.. drops syringe which lands at threshold and seen by uninformed nosy parker... now why they would not just ask SD about it..you're on your own......

btw. I saw a TV show where they had a guy injecting what was supposed to be Lantus in a pen and he took it like a Hare-Kari sword and plunged it into his upper abdomen with force and a surprised expression on his face—hilarious.. and remember the first season of Prison Break..they had some pretty funny stuff about the hero pretending to be a diabetic in prison and going to the Dr for his shots..which strangely did not seem to affect him at all.....ya know...I have had a few laughs about diabetes after all!

[GretchO]

Once my DH and I were eating in a teeny tiny restaurant...very close quarters. I thought it would be best if I went out into the car (parked right out front) to inject. Was sitting in the passenger seat preparing to do my injection and apparently oblivious to what was going on around me when I heard a tap-tap-tap on the window. I looked up and there was a policeman motioning for me to roll the window down. Being the obtuse person I can sometimes be, I asked him if we'd forgotten to put money in the meter or something (?). He asked me what I was doing. Finally dawning on me (injecting insulin just becomes so routine, so second nature that you just don't really think about it and we all know that when you're in your car no one else can see you) I showed him my insulin vial. He just nodded and walked away. So, I guess if you see someone with a needle in a vial, flicking the needle, etc. you might wonder what the heck is going on.

[Subby]

OK..I agree about most normal people not mistaking insulin use for heroin use...however I have had peoples eyes widen in disbelief (never asked why) and I think it was on this forum but maybe not, where somebody posted that a woman in a restaurant smacked the needle out of her hand and across the floor and said "not in here you don't!".. so clearly it does happen...


Here is my two pennorth..

Shamed Diabetic in toilet cubicle.. drops syringe which lands at threshold and seen by uninformed nosy parker... now why they would not just ask SD about it..you're on your own......

btw. I saw a TV show where they had a guy injecting what was supposed to be Lantus in a pen and he took it like a Hare-Kari sword and plunged it into his upper abdomen with force and a surprised expression on his face—hilarious.. and remember the first season of Prison Break..they had some pretty funny stuff about the hero pretending to be a diabetic in prison and going to the Dr for his shots..which strangely did not seem to affect him at all.....ya know...I have had a few laughs about diabetes after all!

And you just gave me a few right there! Thanks. I think there is a book in the making about all the silly stories around insulin and injecting... "The Little Book of Stabs". Or "Human Insulin for the Soul". (Or its lesser known counterpart, "Bovine insulin for the Soul")

[Grunch]

and remember the first season of Prison Break..they had some pretty funny stuff about the hero pretending to be a diabetic in prison and going to the Dr for his shots..which strangely did not seem to affect him at all.....

Actually he had low blood sugar because of the shots.

In an episode of Lie to Me they make it seem like a woman is injecting drugs in the bathroom but then it turns out she was injecting hormones. I don't see any reason why it would be impossible for someone to make that kind of confusion, you just have to make sure it's written in a way that makes sense.

[lark 27]

Definitely a stretch, but I could see a story where a college kid is new at a school and doesn't no anyone so nobody knows he's got D. He hides it very well. One time he's hiding in the bathroom stall while out at a club with friends and drops the syringe after taking a shot (as someone suggested). A not-so close friend is in the room and had heard him tapping the syringe to get out some bad air bubbles and then saw the syringe. That person then tells others that this guy was shooting up in the restroom. Maybe he tells someone who tells someone who tells someone so that the story grows each time to the point where the story becomes that was clearly seen with the tourniquet injecting H when that was never the original story. Of course by this time the original guy that saw it in the bathroom is gone. He was just visiting a friend at college and he never reappears in the book. The plot then is about all the rumors that go around and the things people perceive as drug issues. The guy has a low one day in class and stumbles out to go get sugar and doesn't come back and it's assumed that he's high in class, etc. Maybe another time he goes has DKA and has to spend time at the hospital and people talk about how his family had him put in rehab, but he must have checked himself out because he's back in a couple days. You can make it even more interesting by making the setting a Christian college or something where everybody is supposed to be straight laced and have no issues so the kid become known as the campus rebel-teachers even treat him differently because they hear things through the grapevine. He ends up having all kinds of problems. One of the friends that wasoriginally at the party starts to think well if my buddy is doing Heroin and still surviving college maybe I'll see what it's all about, and you end up with a real addict that the guy with diabetes ends up confronting and trying to help...

This story copyright 2009 by lark 27. lol.

[Mystae]

You can't know that she was low, maybe she was going into DKA and needed insulin. In Con Air it was the same thing, one of the prisoners needed insulin.

Acutally, you can know that she was going low. One of the reasons I watched Panic Room was because they were touting the blood-sugar reading watches in that movie, and I specifically remember being totally incredulous at the part where her blood sugar is dropping significantly and Jodi Foster was like, "She needs more insulin, her blood sugar is dropping!" WHAT?!?!

Con Air was just as bad. Never seen Steel Magnolias (what's wrong with me??? I don't know, either. :O), but I kinda don't want to if it has another scene like those in it...

Makes me pray that I never pass out from a low while around people who have watched too many "Hollywood Diabetics".

[Grunch]

Acutally, you can know that she was going low. One of the reasons I watched Panic Room was because they were touting the blood-sugar reading watches in that movie, and I specifically remember being totally incredulous at the part where her blood sugar is dropping significantly and Jodi Foster was like, "She needs more insulin, her blood sugar is dropping!" WHAT?!?!

I just checked and they never mention insulin in the movie. When the girl was dropping the mother said she needed sugar and they couldn't find stuff with sugar in the room. Later she said the girl needed a shot but didn't mention insulin so it could have been glucagon.

01:05:04.65,01:05:08.03
You dropped to the low 40s.[br]We have to get your blood-sugar up.

01:05:08.11,01:05:09.61
Can you hear me okay?

01:05:09.74,01:05:11.49
l'm just dizzy, not deaf.

01:05:12.49,01:05:14.66
Great. Smart ***. That's excellent.

01:05:14.78,01:05:19.04
Did you see anything in here?[br]Any candy bars or something sweet?

01:05:19.66,01:05:20.83
Let's check it again.

01:07:05.98,01:07:10.36
There's sugar in everything.[br]Places you'd never expect. Like ketchup.

[matingara]

01:05:04.65,01:05:08.03
You dropped to the low 40s.[br]We have to get your blood-sugar up.

01:05:08.11,01:05:09.61
Can you hear me okay?

01:05:09.74,01:05:11.49
l'm just dizzy, not deaf.

01:05:12.49,01:05:14.66
Great. Smart ***. That's excellent.

01:05:14.78,01:05:19.04
Did you see anything in here?[br]Any candy bars or something sweet?

01:05:19.66,01:05:20.83
Let's check it again.

01:07:05.98,01:07:10.36
There's sugar in everything.[br]Places you'd never expect. Like ketchup.



this sounds GRIPPING! i am so sorry i missed whatever it is!

(don't tell me. (a) i won't remember and (b) even if i did i wouldn't watch it...).

:)

-- joel.

[alicat61]

:) Hi,
Evan though it was a long time ago, It was thought I was "doing drugs" one night when I was out with a group of people. (I was doing drugs just the legal ones:D )
I went to a Theatre Resturant with a group of people some I knew and others were friends of friends. When the meal was served I went to bathroom to inject. Aprarently a few of the people who didn't know me saw me inject and raced out to the muteral friend to tell her I was doing drugs in the bathroom.
She put them straight but it shows people can mistake things
When I was 1st diagnosed (27 yrs ago) I used to have to take insulin script to chemist to be able to purchase syringes as they were popular with the illegal drug users. (Now we both get them for free:D )

[dbaratta]

Insulin is injected subcutaneously (into the muscle). No tourniquet required. Back of arms are sometimes used, but more commonly, outside of thighs & tummy area.

It would defy common sense to mistake one for the other.

Insulin is injected into fat not muscle. Shooting into muscle will make it run thru the system like wild fire. :eek:

[Penny]

There was a movie about a grandfather (Kirk Douglas I think) and his son and grandson who were planning a big robbery together.....I can see all the stars, but cannot think of their names. The grandfather and son were arguing and the grandfather plunged an insulin needle through his pans into his thigh. Made me gasp, because I could not imagine ever doing something like that. I use a syringe, twice a day for Lantus, use the pens for Novolog. I have had young children tell their parents I was a drug addict after seeing me use my syringes, the parents laughed about it, so they were not fooled. :D