HOPE in treating my Diabetes.

[Rob43]

I'm going to go back and eating anything I want.

[Rddoms]

Hopefully you are joking. What made you decide to do this if you are being serious?

[adiantum]

I'm sorry your having issues Rob & hope you decide against this

[morrisma]

Fun short term, bad long term unless you like carrots and celery Rob. Sound like moderation rather than abandonment might be a better course.
Mike

[jillybean]

Hope you enjoyed you hands, feet, eyes, and organs while they lasted!

[Rob43]

Why should I treat diabetes when I cann't get answers from two diabetic doctors and the people on here? Why should even try? Been the ER four times this year without any help. Been on blood thinner for seven years to find out it was a waste of money and time one doctor has told me. In the eyes of doctors we are lifetime patients that make them money.

Rob

[e||ement]

rob...no one here WANTS to be doing this.

and, most people here have issues with doctors.

asking for advice on the forum is a good resource, but everyone's diabetes and treatment/management is individual.

if you've truly resolved to "quit" then so be it. that's your choice, although a truly unfortunate one.

to your question of "why should i even try?"...that's not something anyone here can answer. YOU have to want to live a long, healthy life. no one here can make you want that. the only other answer i can come up with is "because you CAN."

think about people who have diseases that can't be managed...they would swap with you in a heartbeat, i would guess.

otherwise, you know the risks of uncontrolled diabetes. they are your risks to take.

i hope you change your mind.

[Rddoms]

If your doctors aren't helping you, then get a new doc! Doctors don't make anymore money if you are sick rather than healthy, you just need to find the right doc. I am currently in medical school, and I can assure you that doctors would rather have healthy diabetic patients. I went to four different doctors until I found the right one, and yes it pissed me off.

You say that you have been to the ER 4 times w/o help, and thus should ignore your disease? That is BS! What do you think will happen if you forget about it? You will die a slow and painful death, period.

I'm sorry that I'm being a bit aggressive, but I spent a few years ignoring my illness. Will there be any side effects due to my inattention? Who knows. My life got so much better when I started taking care of myself, and I hate seeing people going down the same path as I was a few years ago. You need to start by finding the right doctor for you, and then things will start falling into place. Please don't stop treating your disease!!!

[jillybean]

Why should I treat diabetes when I cann't get answers from two diabetic doctors and the people on here? Why should even try? Been the ER four times this year without any help. Been on blood thinner for seven years to find out it was a waste of money and time one doctor has told me. In the eyes of doctors we are lifetime patients that make them money.

Rob
#1 - Find a doctor who will listen.
#2 - If #1 does not work, do your own research for answers.
#3 - What questions have gone unanswered here? I recommend posting on the Type 2 section, not here - this general area tends to get fewer responses, likely due to less traffic.

[foxl]

If your doctors aren't helping you, then get a new doc! Doctors don't make anymore money if you are sick rather than healthy, you just need to find the right doc. I am currently in medical school, and I can assure you that doctors would rather have healthy diabetic patients. I went to four different doctors until I found the right one, and yes it pissed me off.

You say that you have been to the ER 4 times w/o help, and thus should ignore your disease? That is BS! What do you think will happen if you forget about it? You will die a slow and painful death, period.

I'm sorry that I'm being a bit aggressive, but I spent a few years ignoring my illness. Will there be any side effects due to my inattention? Who knows. My life got so much better when I started taking care of myself, and I hate seeing people going down the same path as I was a few years ago. You need to start by finding the right doctor for you, and then things will start falling into place. Please don't stop treating your disease!!!

I agree to both -- get a new physician whom you TRUST, and yet ... it is STILL up to you. Ignore them all at only your own peril. I understand the frustration and attitude -- already went thru it with lipids. You truly have only yourself to handle this. We will help, the support here is tremendous. No matter what any MD tells you, it must come from YOU.

[dbaratta]

I'm going to go back and eating anything I want.

Everybody feels this way from time to time. Don't do that to yourself.......this feeling will pass and if it doesn't talk to your doc and have him help you.

I get frustrated all the time. I don't have super great numbers like some people in this forum. I am not going to eat myself to death though, I am going to adjust and keep on adjusting until I get it right. I have a doc appt in December and if I don't get to where I want to be by then I will make him adjust my meds.

[Josselyn]

Hello, Rob.
You are free to do as you wish, obviously. But if you truly do as you've stated, then over time you are feeding into that mentality by making yourself a lifetime patient who will eventually become very physically dependent on these same doctors.

We determine the extent of our health care involvements, personally and professionally. Please don't let your frustrations with the medical community you're involved with negatively affect the way you treat yourself. I mean, really, who are you hurting with that choice? :confused:

Which questions were you asking on the Forums that you didn't receive assistance with?
I'm somewhat surprised by that.

I've had my frustrations, too...and recently.
I hope you're just venting right now, and you soon realize that the only person in charge of your care is you...and if you abdicate that responsibility, then it doesn't matter who your doctor is.

I hope you get back to taking care of yourself, and that you're feeling better soon.

[sarahspins]

I've been through NINE endocrinologists in just as many years.... sometimes it takes a while to find one you really get along with well. I've left practices for reasons that had very little to do with the doctors as well.

What are the problems you are having? Honestly I looked through all of the threads you've posted recently, and apart from ONE thread on insulin from a few months ago I don't really see where you've actually asked for help from anyone.. I suggested at the time that I suspect you're not taking enough insulin for your needs. I still stand by that statement. From reading some of your posts it sounded like you were still eating "whatever you wanted".

If what you are currently doing is "not working" then you need to figure out why - maybe you need different dosages, maybe you need different meds, maybe you need to seriously reevaluate your diet, but there is NO reason to give up.

[Rob43]

My two doctor's are endocrinologists. One has over 10,000 patients I've been told. This town has only one endocrinologist for over 100,000 people. My other one is in Nashville. My BG today is 450 with me taking shots which is 40 units. All I drink all day is water with Lemon and don't eat much and still my BG is high. I've never been over 500 in all the years of having diabetes.


Rob

[adiantum]

Rob I'm not in tune with your 'shots' but it's obviously not doing the job so time to change type. It's time to change doctors as well. There are some really good GP's so you dont necessarily need an endo. I cant recall your questions here so I either missed them or didn't have an answer.
Are you getting exercise? Even the wheelchair bound must exercise.
We have a better health care system here but even with that I still dont want to make such claims.It's easier to fight the battle with D then to eat up & take the consequences.
You are a valued member of our community so please let us try to keep you with us.

[fgummett]

My BG today is 450 with me taking shots which is 40 units. All I drink all day is water with Lemon and don't eat much and still my BG is high.Ok Rob.. you've been here on DF enough to know that if you are asking for advice we need a lot more specific detail than that...

When was that BG of 450mg/dl taken?

How long since you ate?

What did you eat?

What type of insulin(s) are in your 40 units and when do you take it/them?

How fresh is the insulin... any chance the bottle is out of date, became too hot at some time or in other ways is "bad"?

What do you eat in a typical day? How many grams of carbohydrate?

How active are you?

Answer these question -- in detail -- and I suspect you will get a flood of advice.

---

Your profile has you as Type 2, aged 49 and taking "2000 mgs of Metformin a day and on insulin Novolog Mix 70/30 flexpens. Use pen three times a day." is this information still correct..?

[dbaratta]

My two doctor's are endocrinologists. One has over 10,000 patients I've been told. This town has only one endocrinologist for over 100,000 people. My other one is in Nashville. My BG today is 450 with me taking shots which is 40 units. All I drink all day is water with Lemon and don't eat much and still my BG is high. I've never been over 500 in all the years of having diabetes.


Rob

Lemon? what kind of lemon, natural? I ask because lemon in water for me would give me some high BG readings, plus not eating gives me high BG due to liver dump......

it is frustraging I know.....

[Gary_W]

Hello Rob,

I agree with Frank's post above - give more details about what is going on and ask some specific questions. You'll get advice.

One of the worst things about having diabetes (for me anyway) is that feeling of 'what now???' which comes where the ****ed thing is giving you grief and you really cannot figure out why. For me, as long as I know WHY something is happening and can come up with a plan then I'll be OK. It's when I just 'don't get it' that I start to get feelings similar to yours in terms of 'why bother, as nothing I do works'.

You need to re-frame this. Something will work, it's just you haven't tried the right 'something' yet. And unless you've tried every 'something' at least twice then you can't give up as the one you haven't tried may well be the answer!

[lark 27]

I thinksome good advice has been given thus far, but one more thought. Have you spent much time with certified diabetes educators. Have them start at square one and educate you like it's all brand new. they tend to have more time than endo's and it's their job to educate (meaning make sure you learn and not just making sure they tell you something.)

good luck and one thing I've learned from this site is that SUCCESS IS POSSIBLE!

[Rob43]

Ok Rob.. you've been here on DF enough to know that if you are asking for advice we need a lot more specific detail than that...

When was that BG of 450mg/dl taken? 10:00 AM before eating something.

How long since you ate? 6 hours.

What did you eat? Tell you the truth I ate at Taco Bell. Eat very little home cooked meals. Eat out most of the time.

What type of insulin(s) are in your 40 units and when do you take it/them? Take two shots a day, Novolog Mix 70/30

How fresh is the insulin... any chance the bottle is out of date, became too hot at some time or in other ways is "bad"? On my last two days before running out on this pen.

What do you eat in a typical day? How many grams of carbohydrate? Fast food, Burger King, Hardies, Taco Bell. Instead of drinking pop I Drink water with real lemons,

How active are you? Walk every other day and it's about 2 miles.

Answer these question -- in detail -- and I suspect you will get a flood of advice.

---

Your profile has you as Type 2, aged 49 and taking "2000 mgs of Metformin a day and on insulin Novolog Mix 70/30 flexpens. Use pen Three times a day." is this information still correct..? No, Take shot's only twice a day. One before eating in the morning and one before dinner. Each shot is 16 units and more if BG is high in 400's.

Thanks, Rob

[jenb]

Rob - I looked through some of your earlier postings and found that you are using 70/30 insulin. I do not see how anyone can control blood sugar with a mix. Ask your Dr. to switch you to separate basal and bolus insulin like Levemir and Novolog. The doctor will set your initial basal rate and probably give you a sliding scale for the rapid-acting insulin. Then get either "Think Like a Pancreas" by Gary Scheiner or "Using Insulin" by John Walsh and follow the instructions for basal testing and setting. Either book can also assist you in understanding your insulin to carb ratio and will discuss carb counting.

Perhaps you just need to find the right tools, including modifying your diet and including exercise in addition to the correct medication. Your frustration is understandable, but there are solutions if you are open to them.

Don't let your diabetes go untreated. The downside is too great.

Jen

[Granny Shanny]

Since your original post stated you wish to go back to eating anything you want, may I safely assume that all this fast food is NOT what you want? What kinds of meals will you be going with, if you go ahead and eat anything you want?

[soso]

Hi Rob
I think if you get on a good fast acting insulin, you will do much better even eating at fast food eateries(if that's what you want or have to do) I think all fast food places post their nutritional info online and you could just print it out and keep it handy. A combination of rapid insulin and carb counting will probably dramatically improve your numbers and your outlook....
Don't lose heart...

[davef]

Tell you the truth I ate at Taco Bell. Eat very little home cooked meals. Eat out most of the time.

What do you eat in a typical day? How many grams of carbohydrate? Fast food, Burger King, Hardies, Taco Bell. Instead of drinking pop I Drink water with real lemons,



Rob,

I'm not using Insulin so I don't have much advice to offer there, however if you are only taking a basal insulin, and eating fast food I would think you will not be able to control your diabetes. I would think you NEED a fast acting insulin.

You say you are going back to eating what you want, if you mostly eat fast food, does this mean the only change you have made is to drink water with lemon juice?

As has been said, part of you problem could be the lemon juice, I'm not sure how I would react to lemon juice but suspect it would send me high. Especially if I was to drink alot of it.

Are your Doctors aware of what you are eating? Frank hit the nail on the head by asking you what you eat, as without that information we would have been left thinking that you are being careful about what you eat and that you have made changes, to be honest it really does not look like you have made many changes at all. If you don't want to make changes (and that's your choice) then you NEED to talk to your doctor and talk about a rapid insulin to try and cope with what you are eating.

[fgummett]

OK so we have a bit more detail Rob, but what exactly are you eating at those fast food places? Not drinking pop is a good start but how about skipping the burger-bun and the fries as well? What sauces do you use? Do they have salads or low-carb options? How many grams of carbs are you eating at each meal... each day..?

You say you had a BG of 450mg/dl after a 6 hour fast? What was it before the fast? How often do you test?

I can't imagine trying to manage with a mix insulin... unless you have a rigid schedule where you eat at the same time and amount every day, sleep set hours, and are equally active every day -- I had a Type 1 D friend at school (many years ago) and his day was pretty much regimented around his D -- somehow I get the impression your day is not quite that organised?

Can you talk to your Doctor about MDI with a sliding scale of fast acting insulin and a slow acting basal? Of course that may require more work and discipline on your part -- at least initially -- and simply "covering" carbohydrates with insulin is a recipe for weight gain and increased Insulin Resistance... but it could at least gain you some improved BG control.

There is no simple quick fix that I am aware of... control is going to require you stepping up and taking it yourself... with the help of your Health Care Providers including your Doctor... and DF is always open for suggestions and support.

[DeusXM]

The other element is that an extended period of not eating (say, more than six hours) will actually cause your BG to go up anyway. Personally I find that if I do not eat, my liver starts dumping glucose in order to maintain my body's basic energy requirements, and if I do not compensate for this (something you cannot do with a mix insulin or with a basal alone) then my BG will rise.

I would also second the opinion put forward here that eating takeout most of the time will destroy your BG levels. I personally find it very difficult to eat any meal I haven't cooked myself without having some sort of screw-up when it comes to BG regulation and I probably only eat take out or go to a restaurant maybe two or three times a month - which is pretty much just basic healthy eating anyway. Prepared food is supposed to be calorie (and therefore, carb) dense because the business model behind these things is that you are buying them for the taste rather than the nutritional benefit.

There is a lot you can do to manage diabetes but the onus is on you rather than the doctor - typically if you are on insulin you will need to calculate your jabs yourself and be prepared to vary them rather that stick with a static amount.

[jillybean]

You can eat fast food without having a bunch of carbs. Get a burger (with cheese, bacon, mayo, lettuce, tomato...just avoid things like barbecue sauce or honey mustard that are more sugary) and toss the bun. Or a grilled chicken sandwich, toss the bun. If you need more food, get 2 burgers, no buns, instead of a burger and fries (or anything equally as evil, like onion rings or tater tots or whatever). Heck, Hardee's even makes a low carb burger with a lettuce wrap instead of a bun. Or hit up KFC for some Kentucky Grilled Chicken - just skip the biscuits and mashed potatoes, maybe try their green beans.

I spent multiple consecutive months eating a VERY low carb diet, and, due to my work schedule, I ate out probably 95% of my meals. It is very much possible to be successful while eating out, even fast food.

[fgummett]

I agree that you can include fast food in healthier eating but I also agree that cooking your own real food is best. I'd be concerned about the constant temptation at a fast food place... not sure I have the discipline... and who knows what you are really getting :o

I've been in a few burger places when travelling for work and was surprised that so many are very accommodating when it comes to asking for a burger without the bun... but to be honest I never seem to enjoy the burger as much as I thought I would.

[ShottleBop]

I've been in a few burger places when travelling for work and was surprised that so many are very accommodating when it comes to asking for a burger without the bun... but to be honest I never seem to enjoy the burger as much as I thought I would.

You're eating at the wrong burger places, then. ;)

[Newdiabetic]

Rob,

I'm new at this.....but I was astonished that my Dr. told me my numbers, told his nurse to teach me how to use a meter and sent me home, telling me to do what I could, stick myself twice a day, write down the results, and come back in two weeks.

I wasn't satisfied with this at all. (Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my doctor) I have a computer, so I went to work.I read all that I could.

I haven't been on this forum long enough to know your circumstances, but please don't give up. If you aren't getting the proper support from your Dr, you need to try elsewhere.

Have you seen a dietician? Would it be possible for you to walk everyday? Have you gotten the nutritional information from each of the fast food places so that you can make wise choices? To give you an example....I was eating the breakfast wrap at McDonald's on the days I allowed myself for a treat or if my husband and I are traveling. I didn't even like the wrap. Come to find out, after getting their nutritional information, the Sausage Egg McMuffin (Which I love) had 11 less grams of carbs and over 200 less calories. So, with the nutritional information that I have, I am able to make better (and to me, more filling) choices. I love their Bacon Ranch salad with grilled chicken...another good choice.

The way I try to look at it, is the more I work at it now, the more good habits will be made which means that it will become easier.

I also am in a rush for morning breakfast, so I boil 4 eggs at a time, fix enough grapefruit for 4 breakfasts, and drink a huge glass of water before running out to my job. That's 4 days I don't have to worry about what I'm going to eat.

Please don't give up. I have a friend who gave up and you do not want to have to spend the rest of your life living like he is now having to live. If he knew then what he knows now, I am SURE he would have made more positive choices.

Good luck. I wish you the very best!
Joyce

[inkvisitor]

Rob, I think getting on some rapid acting insulin (Novolog or Humalog) like mentioned before will turn your life around...

Worth a shot, at least! (har, har)

[Rob43]

Hi, The reason I eat out is I'm staying with a friend in their house and I cann't use there stove. Another thing is this friend loves sweets and she has them everywhere in the house. She of course is not a diabetic so she can eat all she wants. She always making cakes over healthy food. This lady is 60 years old and still eats like a kid.

My new doctor will be seeing me Nov 14 and I will tell him what you all have told me about rapid acting insulin.


Thanks, Rob

[Rob43]

Almost forget another thing I don't eat fries at all and this has been years. Eat only a chicken or fish sandwich. I stopped eat hamburgers when someone told me they found a news article in newspaper that said some fast food resturants put worms in hamburgers to get more protein and even if this is not true I cann't get the tought out of my head so now I don't eat any hamburgers any more.

Rob

[Grunch]

Read the mutant laboratory meat claim. Maybe it will change your mind about eating hamburgers.

McDonald's urban legends - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald's_urban_legends)

[musique913]

I'm sure all of us can tell you that it's not good to eat at fast food restaurants, but it's kind of a given for us as diabetics. Sometimes you may need to do this, but you shouldn't do it every day.

If you must eat at a fast food, get a grilled chicken sandwich, toss the bun, no honey mustard(Wendy's is good for that).
They have a great side salad that you can eat with croutons and the salad dressing and get a grilled chicken sandwich with no bun and it's a really low carb and easier.

If you insist on eating at Taco Bell order from the Al Fresco menu, because it gives you lower carb, lower fat options. You still have to watch it, avoid too many carbs or big portions..and stay far away from regular sodas and the fatty stuff they offer there. It also has so much salt, even in the lower calorie options, so the best bet is to find a way to not eat there.

Even if the person you live with doesn't let you use the stove, look for lower fat, lower carb options so you can eat more food and not be hungry, be satisfied by the amount of food you eat, and not feel like you are constantly depriving yourself of the food you enjoy. I know a lot of stores around my area have rotisserie chicken, but you have to watch to not get the barbque or other mixes, just the plain ole kind. I know I can eat 2 or 3 days of meals off of those, with a salad, good carbs and so forth. It even tastes good cold, if you have to eat it that way.

If your blood sugar is as high as it was fasting you *need* to get to a doctor asap, before you do more damage to your body. It *is* that serious. You *will* get worse if you do nothing. I have seen family members who didn't control their diabetes pass away and also lose limbs at a young age, because they insisted on doing it their own way, and eating whatever they want.

Hang in there Rob, don't give up, and use the support here and a new doctor to get back on track.

Sorry for my long-windedness, but your post worried me!

Angela

[Rob43]

Yes even if it isn't true I still stay from hamburgers. I have a friend that works at a hamburger place and he said the grease that is fried right in the hamburger would my you sick if you seen it. After buying a George Foreman Grill I will never eat another resturant hamburger again.


Thanks, Rob

[Rob43]

Some more information about me,

My weight is 180 At one time my weight was 225 four years ago.
My height is 5-8

Rob

[georgepds]

At 5'8" , 180 lbs m, diagnosed type 2, and taking insulin I am surprised your BG is 400+ ( IIRC) . The reason i'm surprised is you are reasonably lean, and are already taking the "med of last resort" for type 2s.

Some thing is wrong here

Good luck on the changes that others have posted

[Russs]

Rob:

It's time to think beyond fast food.

Really.

Fast food, no matter what sort, including what has been talked about in this thread, is nutritionally e-m-p-t-y and acidic. No matter how much insulin or the variety of 'scripts you drop in your body, you will not get what you need which is enzymes, vitamins, complex nutrition, and a slightly alkaline body chemistry.

As a general rule, anything labeled as 'food' that comes from a factory should be very suspect. Take it in small quantities and as seldom as possible.

Start with raw almonds, keep them with you through the day and munch them at 2 hour intervals with water. And while you are at the store, get some vitamins (and take them). If you do this, when you go through the drive-thru you should be needing less from those sacred portals (I'm assuming you are checking BG before you order and adjusting quantities accordingly). The 'it's bad to wait 6 hours to eat' point made up-thread is very valid.

Also, get out for a brisk walk every other day. 1/2 hour is all I ask....15 mins out, 15 mins back.

Rob, I don't know about the others here, but I'd wager we would rather see you modify your behavior just a bit rather than wondering if you will be losing limbs through amputation, having a heart attack, or a stroke first because of the road you are on now. I really don't like being alarmist, but your vitals plus your frustration call for all the stops to be pulled out.....

I also realize that what I'm saying is pretty different from what others council and practice here, but I know from my personal experience that what I'm saying works.

Honest.

[Rob43]

This morning my BG was 358 and now it's 129 after taking 20 units this morning and my 1000 mg metformin pill. I wonder if my needles are not long enought? Or my Pancreas is stopped working? I've had a stress test on my heart and they found no problems. I take one 81 mg aspirin a day and starting multivitamin a day today.


Rob

[musique913]

Your fasting BS is too high..

You may need a longer acting insulin to balance your sugars, but you also *need* to change your diet.

I can't imagine you are feeling well with your sugars varying this much either.

[davef]

This morning my BG was 358 and now it's 129 after taking 20 units this morning and my 1000 mg metformin pill. I wonder if my needles are not long enought? Or my Pancreas is stopped working? I've had a stress test on my heart and they found no problems. I take one 81 mg aspirin a day and starting multivitamin a day today.


Rob

What did you eat for dinner? Do you take Metformin at night? How many units did you take last night?

[Lizzy]

Hey Rob, just jumping in to say, hang in there. Like everyone says, once you get on the right kinds of insulin you should start doing much better and be able to see much better numbers! I do enjoy reading your posts.

[lorilei]

Rob -Then get either "Think Like a Pancreas" by Gary Scheiner or "Using Insulin" by John Walsh and follow the instructions for basal testing and setting. Either book can also assist you in understanding your insulin to carb ratio and will discuss carb counting.



Jen

Cheers jen..i think this book can really help you take control of your own care and feel confident in presenting your concerns to your doc...

also, eating what you want does not punish your doctors...and i know you know this.

take care of the one body you've got.

[Rob43]

I alway have taken 16 units at night and sometime more if BG is high in the 300's. My doctor in Nashville wanted me to take only 16 units a shot and no more. I will telling my new doctor about the longer acting insulin and see what he says. I'm also eating raw almonds also which I love anyway. What about eating fish over any other meats?


Thanks, Rob

[davef]

I alway have taken 16 units at night and sometime more if BG is high in the 300's. My doctor in Nashville wanted me to take only 16 units a shot and no more. I will telling my new doctor about the longer acting insulin and see what he says. I'm also eating raw almonds also which I love anyway. What about eating fish over any other meats?


Rob,

As I understand it, you are already taking long lasting insulin (basal), what I believe you need to discuss is fast acting (bolus) insulin.

Do get the book "Think like a pancreas" I suggested it to a friend and he said it really helped him.

[princesslinda]

Fish is always a good choice, provided it's not breaded and fried. More importantly, is to avoid bread, rice, potatoes, pasta, chips, sweets, that kind of thing.

[Rob43]

I try to eat whole wheat bread when I can like at Subway when you can choice which bread you want.


Rob

[Rob43]

One big reason I don't drink pop is my GERD problem. GERD helps me to not eat the foods like pop and potatoes, pasta, chips, sweets because it makes my GERD much more worse.


Rob

[ShottleBop]

I try to eat whole wheat bread when I can like at Subway when you can choice which bread you want.


Rob

You might try ditching the bread entirely, and getting your sandwich served as a salad. The Subways out here offer that as an option.

[fgummett]

How many grams of carbohydrates in the whole-wheat bread at Subway?

Seems to me that much of what passes these days for "whole-wheat" is little more than white flour with some stuff added back for colour... rather than true whole-grains

[fgummett]

Official SUBWAY Restaurants' Nutrition Information (http://www.subway.com/applications/NutritionInfo/nutritionlist.aspx?id=breadtop)

This site shows that a 6" Nine grain wheat bread has 42g carbohydrates (including 4g fibre)... that's 84g carbs in a footlong :eek:

[Rob43]

Here is my lab work from my Diabetic doctor in Nashville. This was taken on 5/4/09. I know I'm way over due for more lab work.

A1c was 12.3 %
Cholesterol was 231
Triglycerides was 194
HDL was 55
Calculated LDL was 137
Microalbummin 18

Other tests was normal

Urinalysis
Kidney Function
Liver Function
Potassium and other minerals
Blood Protein
Calcium and other bone minerals

Rob

[DeusXM]

Your A1C is very, very, very high. You'll need to completely overhaul your BG treatment regime. You are getting nowhere near enough insulin for what your body needs.

[Subby]

And there is so much to lose and so much to hold onto... now is a great time to come afresh at how you control this condition... most especially while you still don't have obvious damage to the kidneys.

Have you been to an opthamologist to have your checked your eyes for retinopathy? So much can be done for that... if detected early. Let is go = partial or significant blindness. I think your A1c definitely suggests you are at higher risk and need to just do what needs to be done to be checked up and to get better BGs.

As part of reassessing how you are going to deal with your diabetes, along with taking dietary control and modification very serously, and type 2 meds, full blown MDI correctly administered, or a pump, strikes me as potentially offering life changing improvement for you.

[Rob43]

I wonder if the pump would be good for me? I go the a eye doctor once a year at St. Thomas hospital in Nashville. Been going to a eye doctor for 7 years now. Doctor hasn't found any problems yet.

Thanks, Rob

[matingara]

My advice based on my experiences and my opinions:


DON'T EAT ANY BREAD EVER. (also don't eat rice, potatos, cereals, fruit, pasta or any other SUPER-CARB food). Try to eat a max of 50-80 grams of carb per day.
USE RAPID ACTING INSULIN at meal times matched to your carb intake (Novolog).
USE a LONG ACTING INSULIN (e.g. Lantus) as a basal


:)

-- Joel.

[DannyK]

Ditto

I'm coming up on my first year since dx., and I have yet to have a slice of bread, grain of rice, one french fry, or any type of fruit. At first I thought "what can I eat?", but now have realized there is PLENTY of good food out there, and I am never hungry.

[fgummett]

I'd also echo Joel (matingara's) suggestions plus keeping a log of food, BG, activity AND frequent BG testing.

An A1c of 12.3% is (according to the converter on DF) equivalent to an average blood glucose of 361 mg/dl... that's an "average" (mean)... so either you are constantly at 361, or spend an equal amount of time below and above that dangerously high BG level.

You need to take action and take charge Rob. This health risk goes beyond being polite to the people you are living with.

[irishnproud2b]

Ditto

I'm coming up on my first year since dx., and I have yet to have a slice of bread, grain of rice, one french fry, or any type of fruit. At first I thought "what can I eat?", but now have realized there is PLENTY of good food out there, and I am never hungry.

Ok, I'm brand new here, but I'd like to know what you consider "plenty of good food out there" when you gave up all bread, potatoes, rice, etc? I was just put on insulin after 6 years of just pills did not do the trick. I'm struggling. Kathie

[ShottleBop]

Ok, I'm brand new here, but I'd like to know what you consider "plenty of good food out there" when you gave up all bread, potatoes, rice, etc? I was just put on insulin after 6 years of just pills did not do the trick. I'm struggling. Kathie

Low-Carb Daily Diet Thread (http://www.diabetesforums.com/forum/dieting-and-nutrition-diabetes/39716-low-carb-daily-diet.html). Check it out.

Yesterday:

For breakfast, I had my usual: avocado and a whey protein shake mixed with unsweetened almond oil.

Midmorning snack: a handful of walnuts

For lunch: a Cobb salad, dressed with olive oil.

Midafternoon snacks: almonds, pork rinds (pork rinds are especially good for satisfying the need for crunch, and, if anything, they seem to lower my BGs)

Dinner: stir-fry, made with some leftover Italian sausage, a Louisiana hot sausage, shrimp, almonds, green beans, and broccoli slaw; low-carb homemade pumpkin ice cream (sweetened with stevia, the only carbs come from the unsweetened pumpkin and the minimal no. of carbs in heavy cream).

And welcome to the DF!

[Rob43]

Thanks for the information on food but I would reither be dead because if I cann't enjoy eating what I want life's not worth living. Type two Diabetic's makes bad patients because of a life of eating anything you want and then having to just quit your favorite foods like Cakes and pies.


Rob

[Granny Shanny]

Sorry to hear that, Rob. All I can say now is - I wish you well. I hope you'll see your doc very soon & make some attempt to work out your myriad medical maladies. I still think there's hope, but you have to think so too.

[sridder]

I was diagnosed in April so this is my first "holiday" season with Type 2 diabetes. In my experience, you don't have to quit the things you enjoy - you just have to compromise. For example we have an old family recipe for Pumpkin pie that calls for brown sugar and dr. pepper. It may sound strange but it's absolutely delicious - the only kind of pumpkin pie I'll eat. Anyway, a couple weekends ago I made a test run of the recipe using brown sugar substitute and diet dr. pepper. It was absolutely delicious and didn't adversely affected my BG levels. My family loved it too - they couldn't tell a difference at all. I smiled EVERY time I took a bite of that pie because I was so happy that it tasted so good and wasn't bad for me. I've done the same thing with other favorite recipes throughout the year and plan to do more experimenting as we move into my official "baking" season. I'll still make some old favorites for friends and family but I'll have some "good for me/can't tell the difference/doesn't affect my BG levels" treats so I won't feel deprived.

[sridder]

One other thing I want to say...my middle son (age 16) came up to me randomly a couple weeks ago while I was checking my BG level and said, "Mom, you're a really good diabetic" I asked what he meant and he said he was proud that I monitored my BG levels and modified my diet and did what I do to keep my diabetes in control. I told him it wasn't always easy but I did it, not only for myself, but also for him, his brothers and his dad. I love them and I want to be with them without complications for as long as I can. My son said he was glad because he wanted that too. Rob - If you can't for whatever reason keep going with your treatment for yourself, consider doing it for those around you who love you so much.

[Rob43]

I'm not giving up just yet. This is hard for me because of a past of eating anything I wanted and cann't now.


Thanks, Rob

[DeusXM]

To be honest, Rob, not being able to eat what you used to is just a part of aging. I find I'm much less able to eat junk food than I used to be, simply because I'm older and seem to put weight on more easily now.

[Evermont]

Rob, Have you been checked for periodontal disease? How's your sleep hygiene? Are you stressed? Do you have weight to lose and a plan to lose it?

There are a few knobs and dials that we can tweak beyond just dietary restriction - these things may also help.

[Rob43]

I havn't been able to sleep a full eight hours like did when I was young. I've been having to get up to bathroom every night for last 2 years and I sleep off and on all night. I can sleep better during the day then at night for some reason.


Rob

[Subby]

Rob, I feel like am haunting you, but this is another genuine response....

I can't sleep during the night without good BG control. Being high stresses my body and I will drift in and out for most of the start of the night. WHen my BG is out of whack, I can only sleep when I am completely exhausted in the morning. If high, I am dead to the world, yet I get no quality of sleep.

The toilet, is very much likely due to ketosis from running high constantly.

Everything you are saying is completely typical of suffering the effects of high BGs. This is the wall in front of you, and you keep saying you don't want to take the stairs that some others take. That's fine, and although some tend to infer theirs is the only "true" way, I would say there are many ways around, under or through that wall, but you need to be looking into those possibilities with open eyes.

I think we'd all like to help you to get over this hurdle, which seems to have been going on for some months or even years? You could be feeling much better within a few weeks, and it does not HAVE to be from forgoing all refined carbs, it does not have to mean a strictness that has obviously had you in denial for a long time now and keeping your back turned. But I feel more does need to come from you. At the moment, I am very uncomfortable with the fact this thread is called "Giving up the treatment of Diabetes", every time I see that I think that is still where you feel you really are. If you really do have a spark of wanting to get on top of this, I hope you might consider starting a new thread where we can look at some of the avenues open to you on more even footing.

[Cluck]

Dear Rob

I have read most of this thread and hope I have understood your main points. These seem to be that you want to eat what you like (which you do anyway), but you would like to have better BG numbers. I think you realise that where you are now is not a good place to be.

While I personally try to restrict my carb intake, in theory there is no reason why you can't eat what you want and cover it with insulin if you were on the right insulin protocol.

Right now you are not. Others have suggested that you get your doctor to put you on a basal (Lantus or Levemir) insulin and a bolus (novolog or humalog) insulin. That way you could take the right amount of insulin at meal times to cover what you are eating.

As Subby suggests though, this means more effort would have to come from you: learning to count carbs for one thing so that you can take the right bolus.

I wish you all the best on your journey and I hope that you get the help that you need from your doctors.

[georgepds]

Dear Rob

...in theory there is no reason why you can't eat what you want and cover it with insulin if you were on the right insulin protocol...

This is what I thought.. that once you began treating with insulin it was just a question of injecting the proper amount of fast acting insulin to cover for the carbs eaten.

It's not the best plan (most would probably gain weight) but it does let you eat what you want without the burden of high BG

--G

[Rob43]

I've started to cut out sweets and now eat mainly healthier foods. I love cottage cheese with low sugar peaches. I'm not giving up with living so I keep taking my insulin shots and pills. I've been eating mainly whole grain wheat bread at Subway and have been doing this for years.

I've been having pains where I put my insulin pen in my right lower side of stomach. Can a person uses a place to much when it comes to injections?

Rob

[Grunch]

Yeah, they usually tell you to rotate the place of injections. Injecting always on the same place can cause problems.

[Coppernob]

I've started to cut out sweets and now eat mainly healthier foods. I love cottage cheese with low sugar peaches. I'm not giving up with living so I keep taking my insulin shots and pills. I've been eating mainly whole grain wheat bread at Subway and have doing this for years.

I've been having pains where I put my insulin pen in my right lower side of stomach. Can a person uses a place on them to much when it comes to injections? Rob
In answer to your question, yes, you should move the location of your shots around. I used to give my shots all over my abdomen and stomach area, then sometimes I'd use my arm or leg too. Now I am on a pump, I have to move the infusion set placement around but that is only every three days.
Good luck, Rob - it sounds as if you are feeling a bit more positive now and have made some good choices. Good for you. :)

[Cluck]

This is what I thought.. that once you began treating with insulin it was just a question of injecting the proper amount of fast acting insulin to cover for the carbs eaten.

It's not the best plan (most would probably gain weight) but it does let you eat what you want without the burden of high BG

--G

I didn't say it was the best plan and it's not one I follow myself. However, it is the advice I was given by more than one diabetic dietician

Rob seems to want to eat what he wants and this is the way to do it.

[dbaratta]

I didn't say it was the best plan and it's not one I follow myself. However, it is the advice I was given by more than one diabetic dietician

Rob seems to want to eat what he wants and this is the way to do it.

Insulin to cover the carbs works for me short term. If i eat the wrong carb or too many carbs my 2-hours post is good because I know what to bolus, but, my liver dumps later on....proper foods for some of us is the only way......:confused:

[sable_032592]

My two doctor's are endocrinologists. One has over 10,000 patients I've been told. This town has only one endocrinologist for over 100,000 people. My other one is in Nashville. My BG today is 450 with me taking shots which is 40 units. All I drink all day is water with Lemon and don't eat much and still my BG is high. I've never been over 500 in all the years of having diabetes.


Rob


i live in a town with NO endo, 1 doctor who comes to town twice a week and he's an old doctor who doesn't listen and likes to give out pills...

i have an endo that took me over 10 years to find and he's 3 hours drive away, the nearest hospital is an hour away, but there are 911 and first response teams in the building next to my house and live right beside the pharmacy, where the first responders are...

i would rather have an endo closer to me, but until i find one, i go for a 3 hour drive at least 3 or 4 times a year... my opto is also 3 hours away, and i see her every 4 months for more laser shots in the eye... i'm seeing her on the 13th of november and my endo on the 18th of december...

there is a clinic about 20 minutes away but they have limited access to medical items so i go for tests at the hospital... i don't think anyone is living their life they way they imagined it...

i would love to give up all the meds, just last night,i spent a hour doing my pill for the next few weeks, which i do every saturday night, as well as enter all my levels and shots for the past week...

i feel for you, as i'm sure everyone here does, but you have to hand in there... there must be people who know and love you who would be extremely sad to see you go... and not taking your meds and letting go right now might seem like a better thing, certainly a happier thing, but what happens when you wake up and want to live? the damage will be done... please think about this...

[Cluck]

Insulin to cover the carbs works for me short term. If i eat the wrong carb or too many carbs my 2-hours post is good because I know what to bolus, but, my liver dumps later on....proper foods for some of us is the only way......:confused:

I was simply suggesting a compromise for the OP; someone who is talking about giving up treating his diabetes altogether and has fasting BGS of over 350! What were your suggestions for him?

[Rob43]

I'm contacted the Tony to change the title to the thread to Hope in treating my diabetes instead of giving up on my treatment of Diabetes.

My Diabetic doctor here in this small town I live in is from northern Canada and has been here for over 23 years he has told me. He's the one with 10,000 patients.

Thanks, Rob

[Cluck]

I'm contacted the Tony to change the title to the thread to Hope in treating my diabetes instead of giving up on my treatment of Diabetes.

My Diabetic doctor here in this small town I live in is from northern Canada and has been here for over 23 years he has told me. He's the one with 10,000 patients.

Thanks, Rob

Rob is is wonderful to hear that you still have hope left for treating your diabetes! Good on you :D

[sable_032592]

I'm contacted the Tony to change the title to the thread to Hope in treating my diabetes instead of giving up on my treatment of Diabetes.

My Diabetic doctor here in this small town I live in is from northern Canada and has been here for over 23 years he has told me. He's the one with 10,000 patients.

Thanks, Rob

way to go rob! you hang in there and we'll all make it...

[Granny Shanny]

Yay! Good for you, Rob, and Thanks, Tony!

[Russs]

Rob:

I'm glad you've started up a couple of things I've suggested (multi-vitties and raw almonds). Keep going - a couple of things to consider:

1. Use the raw almonds to 'graze' through the day, allowing you to eat less fast-'food'.

2. The next thing is - take a walk every other day. You will find that you will need less insulin if you start and keep this habit.

Good luck, man I know you can make life better for yourself, one step at a time (pun intended).

[Rob43]

Russs,

I'm doing what you have told me and also I'm not eating fast food much anymore. Maybe some Subway but that's it.


Thanks, Bob

[Granny Shanny]

I just love this thread with its new title! Yay HOPE! :D :D :D

[Rob43]

I've been to my endocrinologist in Nashville and had my three month test done. He said my kidneys are to healthy to have problems and he didn't seem to worried about ketones. What other health problem would cause this smell? He has given me different insulin to take and here it is, Lantus and Novolog pens.

Chart for Novolog

70-150 6 units
150-200 7 units
200-250 8 units
250-300 9 units
300-350 10 units
over 350 11 units

22 units at bedtime for Lautus.


Thanks, Rob

[Subby]

What did the doctor say about the breath?

Rob, well done for taking this step, I applaud you. If the sliding scale does not work that well, be aware that this is certainly not the best system to use esepcially if you continue to eat a highish carb diet. So give it a go, but it can probably be improved two ways: 1, in adjusting the amounts if they are insufficient, and 2, in moving to a more precise method, counting carbs and using a corretion factor.

Hope things improve!

[ramon]

My two doctor's are endocrinologists. One has over 10,000 patients I've been told. This town has only one endocrinologist for over 100,000 people. My other one is in Nashville. My BG today is 450 with me taking shots which is 40 units. All I drink all day is water with Lemon and don't eat much and still my BG is high. I've never been over 500 in all the years of having diabetes.


Rob

This reading is insane and I hate to say it but one day you will feel sick in the stomach and a few hours later have kidney failure. What type of insullin are you on? There are different kinds, some act almost instantly and some can take hrs. I know where you coming from my brother don't give up. I got to the point where I didn't care and now my legs are all red and painful to the touch.If you don't fight back with the quacks the think you don't care so its useless to try and help you. SURPRISE the bum and tell him you are thinking of suing and watch his attitude change real quick. Hang in there bro and please keep in touch.

[Rob43]

My Doctor at St Thomas Hospital didn't seem to worry about this smell or my breath. He said my last test in May showed no problems with my Kidneys and now I'm wondering if he's wrong. I might go to ER for another opinion. Weird thing is why didn't I have this smell when I was on Metformin and Glyburide for seven years? This smell started when I was put on insulin.

Thanks, Rob

[davef]

Rob,

It could simply be that since you start insulin you numbers have been running high.

Have you attended any diabetes education classes, they could help you better understand how to use your two insulins (Lantus for Basal and Novolog (Bolus) for correction), as Subby mentioned the process of counting the carbs you eat and then using the Novolog to bolus. As I understand it (and I'm not using insulin) what you are currently being told to use the Novolog based on your readings, so you are reacting, whereas when you count carbs and inject to cover (bolus) the carbs you are stopping the numbers rise - being pro-active.

Best of luck with your new regime. I would think you should see fairly quick results. Make sure to test often so that you don't have hypos. If you find you are still struggling with your numbers then go back to your Endo/Doctor or Diabetes education class.

[Rob43]

Told me to use this chart when giving myself insulin.

Chart for Novolog

70-150 6 units
150-200 7 units
200-250 8 units
250-300 9 units
300-350 10 units
over 350 11 units

22 units at bedtime for Lautus.


Thanks, Rob

[Jan B]

Hi Rob,

Excuse my ignorance please . . .

Is this chart to be used before meals?

[Rob43]

Yes before meals. He said to wait 15 minutes after taking shot before eating.

Rob

[Rob43]

I wonder what other health problems could cause ketoacidosis other then Diabetes? I tried to find it on the internet without any luck.

I sure it's because of my diabetes because all this smell came ownly after starting insulin for some reason. The weird thing is it has started to go away after I started eatting more food for some reason.

What is this insulin called Lantus and I'm taking 22 units at night before I go to bed. How does it work at night?

Thanks, Rob

[Grunch]

Alcohol can cause ketoacidosis. Alcoholic Ketoacidosis (http://www.merck.com/mmpe/sec12/ch158/ch158e.html)

What you had was very likely not ketoacidosis, just ketosis which happens when you are eating very few or no carbs. The body breaks fat and throws ketones in the blood.

[Rob43]

Thank you all for the information. I have learned alot.


Rob