[w5wjp]

Since the Spirit was on my short list of pumps, I called them today.

Wow....what an attitude!!!!!

That is the way our pumps have always been and always will be...etc Don't you what new and better technology? I told them that "new and better" can be an oxymoron and they told me that obviously I don't NEED their pump.

My list is now down to Cozmo and Minimed.

[trifona]

Originally Posted by w5wjp

Since the Spirit was on my short list of pumps, I called them today.

Wow....what an attitude!!!!!

That is the way our pumps have always been and always will be...etc Don't you what new and better technology? I told them that "new and better" can be an oxymoron and they told me that obviously I don't NEED their pump.

My list is now down to Cozmo and Minimed.

Unbelievable! They used that EXACT Phrase when I called them last month: "Don't you what new and better technology?". They also had an unconscionable attitude about it..both times I called. Once it was late on the weekend and I only spoke to technical support, so I figured I would wait to speak to a regular pump rep during the day, and got the same lines and same attitude. It is obvious that they are on a script. They need to change that script and retrain their employees.

It is a BLATANT LIE that their pumps have aways been that way. They used to require a "technical inspection" every two years and during this time they would reset the timers for another two years before another inspection was due. After I upgraded to the D-Tron I had my H-Tron's sent in for inspection and timers reset, and they had no problem in following the procedure then. No....they just changed their procedure.

I received a letter along with a D-Tron replacement pump earlier in the fall. The letter was a notice that the wording for Alert 5 & Error 5 on the back of the pump was being changed from "Technical Inspection Due" to "End of Use Time"

In Disetronic jargon, Alert means it is coming soon (3 weeks warning If I recall correctly) and Error means it is imminent that the pump will shut down.

[KMP]

Thanks for posting this thread. I am interested in getting a pump and I cannot believe that they pull this type of programming. Ugggggggg.

"Hey use our product ...we will tell you it lasts forever...but we ALSO program it to die in a few years so you HAVE to come crawling back to us.... Don't worry about it Just give us your money" Ugggggg

[It Ain't Over]

Originally Posted by notme

That would definitely be a deal breaker for me. I don't want a shelf life on my pump. Heck....my pancreas did that already and I wasn't happy.

Now that is the humor only a 'd' could understand

[w5wjp]

Local rep for Accuchek called this morning. Told her about the call to tech support and the "feature".

She admitted that the pump did shut down at 6 years. Asked her about what would happen if I did not have insurance in 6 years and she said "You would need to get a new pump. Don't you want new and better technology?"

She was surprised at the attitude of tech support. She also said that they have sold pumps for as low as $5/mo to people without insurance.

Ummmmmm....$5 guzinta $5500, 1100 times. Six years is only 72 months. 1100/72 = dead pump. Anyone else have problems with this math?

[Funnygrl]

Originally Posted by w5wjp

Local rep for Accuchek called this morning. Told her about the call to tech support and the "feature".

She admitted that the pump did shut down at 6 years. Asked her about what would happen if I did not have insurance in 6 years and she said "You would need to get a new pump. Don't you want new and better technology?"

She was surprised at the attitude of tech support. She also said that they have sold pumps for as low as $5/mo to people without insurance.

Ummmmmm....$5 guzinta $5500, 1100 times. Six years is only 72 months. 1100/72 = dead pump. Anyone else have problems with this math?

Man, that's like paying for 92 years for a pump that will last 6 years. The $5/month must include some kinda discount. I am pretty sure most of the companies give discounts for those without insurance.

[JediSkipdogg]

Originally Posted by Funnygrl

Man, that's like paying for 92 years for a pump that will last 6 years. The $5/month must include some kinda discount. I am pretty sure most of the companies give discounts for those without insurance.

And it's usually a model a few back. I know people can still get a Minimed 508 for like $1000. I can't recall where I saw that once, but it was a huge discount. Basically the pump company just wanting to get rid of older pumps that are traded in. Heck, the pump was sold once, they made $6000 then, they give you $500 to sell it back to them, then they resell it after a checkup for say $1000. Another $500 profit for them.

[trifona]

Originally Posted by w5wjp

Local rep for Accuchek called this morning. Told her about the call to tech support and the "feature".

She admitted that the pump did shut down at 6 years. Asked her about what would happen if I did not have insurance in 6 years and she said "You would need to get a new pump. Don't you want new and better technology?"

The only good thing in that line of rubbish is the apparent confirmation of what was earlier suspected; That buyers have no further options once the timers run down.

Page 159 of the Spirit Reference manual, states:

"Contact Pump Support @ 1-800-688-4578 to discuss your options for further use of the Accu-Chek Spirit insulin pump"

That statement is a line of bull designed to deceive. The only option available to the end user is to go back to syringes or buy a new insulin pump. There are no options for further use of this pump based on the above quoted statement.

No notice in their marketing materials and apparent deception in their reference materials. Disgusting.

[JasonJayhawk]

If I were an investor reading this forum, I'd be dumping my shares pretty quickly...but then again, maybe not --read on. The "new and better technology" song must be what they sing to insurance companies.

Some insurance companies require specific pumps.

They will likely offer significant discounts to insurance companies that select this device as their covered medical equipment. Insurance companies will love the steep discounts, because I see no feasable reason why a user would select this pump -- with the exception of enjoying the "upside down" screen.

(And why do I fear they have a patent on this feature to prevent other companies from doing the same thing?)

This is why the customer service can afford to be rude. They know that their patients will only be using them because they had no other choice.

They call this the "Spirit"? Sounds like something evil to me. And by the way, the only people they would offer a pump to for $5/month would likely be a very limited case (perhaps a famous person?). But if you think about it, the pump materials probably cost less than $50 to manufacturer. This is a big cash cow. The high cost is in marketing ($750-$1,000 commission to the pump rep that sells it to you), insurance/lawsuit, R&D, and of course, payment for the engineers and 24 hour customer service.

[diabolique]

Hello to everyone.
I have just joined this forum and I am delighted to find a place to meet other diabetics and pump users such as myself. This is my first post.

I just got the Spirit about 10 days ago after being on the H-Tron for 10 years. I admit I did little research and impulsively said yes to the Spirit. What attracted me to it was that the pump and meter data can be downloaded via infrared connection to a Zire palm pilot that is also included. I had been using an old Palm One with an inexpensive shareware for manually entering and collating data for blood sugars/bolus/meals/carbs and of course exporting that data from the Palm to my home computer so I could organize it for my doctor. I am sure many of you do this.

I just called Accuchek/Disetronic because I couldn't figure out how to download the meter/pump data exported to the Zire PalmOne to my home computer using the AccuChek software shipped with the Spirit loaded on my computer.

Guess what: YOU CAN'T. The tech rep explained that I should just show my doctor the handheld device. "That's how to use it!" You can back up the data, she assured me but you can't "see" or output it! She assured me there will be new software in a year.

I just can't begin to express the stupidity of that design or amazement that a major multinational pharmacutical can overlook the obvious. If this tech is not mistaken, it means the whole purpose of the Spirit system is defeated. This is not "new & better technology", this is just dumb.

When I tell people I've been diabetic for 30 years they often assume the needles are the worst thing about managing diabetes. No it's not. Nor is pricking your finger 5,6,7,8 times a day, nor the diet restrictions. I think the worst thing is the record keeping, methodically writing this all down, day in and day out for the doctor! I hoped the Spirit System would make the record keeping easier. Alas, not so.

I will call again tomorrow, go up the management chain and see if I can get more information.

Many thanks.

[egi]

When I researched different pumps, I think I was told that I have 30 days
to return the pump for a full refund, if I don't like it.

You might want to consider this option, if available to you.

[JediSkipdogg]

Sorry to hear your bad experience. My personal peeve with companies is they don't tell the full story on their websites and many times you have to specifically ask them the question you want answered. For example, with each company here is my biggest peeve.....

Cozmo - Still thinking on this.

Animas - They don't inform about the stinging sensation one may have. Granted, it's a small percent of users, it's large enough to annoy many that have it, but only turn a small percent away (I'd say less than 1/2%.)

Minimed - They pull people in with their CGMS, yet forget to tell many that it's not insurance covered. They also tell people that it's superbly accurate, but neglect to say it does have flaws some have readings that are extremely off and false alarms at times.

Spirit - They insist that insurance will replace a pump in 4 years so they have the timer on their pump for good reasons. What they fail to realize is that not all insurance companies will replace with the 4 year deadline and that it's unsurance right now how many insurance companies will replace a pump based on the 4 year deadline. Therefore thousands of users (mainly those that may/can lose insurance in 4 years from now) are left hanging and can go pumpless in 4 years. I know I could lose my job any day being government base and if I went without a pump in 4 years I could be really screwed on control since I rely heavily on it now and I would actually use a pump out of warranty instead of taking a gamble of not using a pump at all.




Keep in mind the above are personal peeves. HOwever, they are ones that you have to actually know in advance before going to their website. The companies either swear or neglect to mention the above problems until you basically drill them about it and even then, sometimes act like it's so small. Many times they also pull you in with thier "future promises" that they can't give any date on coming out. ALL pump companies are notorious for this but they have ZERO say on what the furure will bring. The FDA/Gov't controls that and Accu-Chek found that out with their Spirit pump when their Spirit was ready for realease in 2005 but was held back by a simple 3-5 year old import ban on out of country pumps.

[JasonJayhawk]

Thanks for the info and for signing up to share it, diabolique.

I hope your 30-day limit is not up. This is a little known fact from pump companies -- do not allow them to stall you to the 30 days. Your insurance company can also help with the return of this product.

The only way this pump will succeed in the market is if they get insurance companies to exclusively offer this pump only. The H-Tron is known by my endocrinologist as a "work-horse pump" -- no thrills, no features, simply enough to let a person survive.

I'd love to see a Spirit company rep comment on this thread.

[Funnygrl]

I created a chart that got published on the Insulin-Pumpers.org website. I mentioned this flaw and lo and behold, within 24 hours a spirit rep did e-mail me to complain.

I can assure you the ACCU-CHEK Spirit insulin pump will not shut down after four years. I’m not sure how this rumor was started, but as a representative of the company, and one of the marketing people responsible for bringing it to market, I can assure you it is not true.

That's part of the e-mail he sent. I referred him to this thread, and he maintained he ground.

[JasonJayhawk]

This would be an interesting question to call and ask one of their reps. Hmmmm, a recorded phone call...to be posted on the forum!

Jedi...did you ever call your local rep?