[Mr Jensee]

Well regardless I am screwed till Monday when the office opens. My Doctor is an Endocrinologist and yes all the tests necessary have been performed. I have seen him for the past year and have managed to lose weight and keep the blood glucose in check. I checked the Symilin website and the package directions and nowhere does it say anything about using it without insulin therapy. This is why I called them. I am also a Paramedic and know a lot about diabetes, insulin resistance, etc. I am insulin resistant. I am increasing my excersize to see if this will make a difference. I am definitely making a move to get back on the Byetta. I am not interested in starting insulin as I know how much harder it is to regulate. While I still have pancreatic activity I intend to not become dependent on insulin. Studies have shown people who go to insulin before cesation of natural insulin production tends to cause the pancreas to shut down all together. Why do this unnecessarily?

[Cyborg]

Originally Posted by Mr Jensee

Studies have shown people who go to insulin before cesation of natural insulin production tends to cause the pancreas to shut down all together. Why do this unnecessarily?

Are you sure about this? Perhaps it could offset some of the workload from your pancreas until you are able to reduce your insulin resistance through exercise and weight loss. It would also help get the bg down and reduce your chances of complications and help the Symlin to work as designed.

[Mr Jensee]

Yeah I am pretty sure. In type two diabetes, my diabetes the immune system attacks the islets of langerhans, the cells that produce insulin, slowly killing them off. By introducing insulin the body sees no reason to produce the insulin on its own. The cell destruction can intensify. The old adage, if you don't use it you lose it applies here as well.

[JediSkipdogg]

Originally Posted by Mr Jensee

Yeah I am pretty sure. In type two diabetes, my diabetes the immune system attacks the islets of langerhans, the cells that produce insulin, slowly killing them off. By introducing insulin the body sees no reason to produce the insulin on its own. The cell destruction can intensify. The old adage, if you don't use it you lose it applies here as well.

What you just said right there is type 1 diabetes. Type 2 has nothing to do with an immune system killing off.

Also, I find it odd that you say type 2s can use Symlin without insulin and that nothing is wrong with your dosage yet it's not working for you and the company's website says to be used with insulin and that the max recommended dosage is 20 units. Just puzzles me there.

[Mr Jensee]

Originally Posted by JediSkipdogg

What you just said right there is type 1 diabetes. Type 2 has nothing to do with an immune system killing off.

Also, I find it odd that you say type 2s can use Symlin without insulin and that nothing is wrong with your dosage yet it's not working for you and the company's website says to be used with insulin and that the max recommended dosage is 20 units. Just puzzles me there.

Obviously you are misinformed then. Type 2 diabetes is not just one diabetic malfunction. There can be insulin resistance, mine is. There there can be a dying off of insulin producing cells mine also is. There can be problem with the Liver processing glucose a problem I may be having as well. The immune system can attack the iselts of langerhands. The only thing that differentiates them is that Type one or Juvenile Onset diabetes is a total non functioning pancreas early in life. Type 2 more times than not will revert to total insulin dependence, it just develops later in life as mine did. Both of these versions of the disease (dysfunction) are progressive. the type 1 type 2 are used to differentiate if this was early onset, or adult later onset diabetes. Nothing more. Type one BTW is always insulin dependent. Type 2 will most likely progress to insulin dependency but that won't make it Type 1.

And if I could figure out the rationale of why my doctor's nurse practitioner put me on this stuff then I would probably not be in this fix. I plan to get documentation on what she was talking about when I speak to her Monday.

[Cyborg]

All I can say is: Please read up more on the differences between type 1 and type 2. Jedi is correct...

[JediSkipdogg]

Originally Posted by Mr Jensee

Obviously you are misinformed then. Type 2 diabetes is not just one diabetic malfunction. There can be insulin resistance, mine is. There there can be a dying off of insulin producing cells mine also is. There can be problem with the Liver processing glucose a problem I may be having as well. The immune system can attack the iselts of langerhands. The only thing that differentiates them is that Type one or Juvenile Onset diabetes is a total non functioning pancreas early in life. Type 2 more times than not will revert to total insulin dependence, it just develops later in life as mine did. Both of these versions of the disease (dysfunction) are progressive. the type 1 type 2 are used to differentiate if this was early onset, or adult later onset diabetes. Nothing more. Type one BTW is always insulin dependent. Type 2 will most likely progress to insulin dependency but that won't make it Type 1.

And if I could figure out the rationale of why my doctor's nurse practitioner put me on this stuff then I would probably not be in this fix. I plan to get documentation on what she was talking about when I speak to her Monday.

You are totally incorrect in all of your thinking. Age has NOTHING to do with type 1 or type 2. The old term Juvenile Diabetes is now 100% without a doubt called type 1. Adult onset is 100% wihtout a doubt called type 2. If you don't believe me then go to the JDRF (Juvenile Diabetes Research Foundation), ADA (American Diabetes Association), or IDF (International Diabetes Federation.) Those are the three largest diabetes organizations in the world.

Type 1 is caused by an autoimmune disease that attacks the islet cells. It can occur anytime in life, but it generally occurs in early childhood, but not always. There is no cure at all for type 1 and all type 1s WILL REQUIRE insulin. There is a surgical procedure going on a few places with islet cell transplants, however, the results are not very promising in terms of long term.

Type 2 is the one that is greatly on the rise and is many times preventable. This is what is setting a red flag off in every medical office across the country as more and more teenages develope type 2 by being overweight. It is not always sparked by weight, but generally most cases have some weight issues. Type 2 though is when the body has either a low production of insulin or the body has the inability to use the insulin produced (generally called insulin resistance.) Many times the islet cells will die off though as they are being overworked. If they are attempting to produce more insulin that they can, then they slowly die off faster than they replenish. THat is why sometimes type 2s are started on insulin (generally just a basal insulin like Lantus.) The insulin gives their islet cells a break from overworking and can prevent them from needing a bolus insulin (Novolog, etc.)

Therefore pal, I think you need to read up on diabetes.

[Mr Jensee]

So WTF?? You just reiterated what I said. Nothing new added to the conversation. Think you need to learn how to read...

[JediSkipdogg]

Originally Posted by Mr Jensee

So WTF?? You just reiterated what I said. Nothing new added to the conversation. Think you need to learn how to read...

No I didn't. You said type 2 can be an immune disorder. You also stated that age plays a role in determining type 1 vs 2. Both of those are not true.

[jeggeman31]

I think someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed!

[linda53]

I started on Symlin last week. He started me on 10 units before each meal....I have been so nauseated and vomiting and want to know if this goes away after a while as it is really helping my PP readings actually so low I have cut my nightime insulin.

[linda53]

mmmmm I thought I had posted to this....well I am new and my endo started me on 10 units before each meal well breakfast lunch and dinner. I have been so sick so I called him up today and he himself not the nurse always returns the calls he feel are the most needy at the moment. He told me to cut down to 5 units starting with breakfast in the morning...then after a couple of days try the 10 units again....I am also on Humalog 75/25 50 units am and pm but last night my bedtime number was 52 so I skipped my normal insulin dose and when I woke up it was still under 100....so maybe this will work...yeah I know we are insulin resisitant but its about time they have an insulin that is man made...what do you all think?

[JediSkipdogg]

Symlin and a mixed insulin? That is nothing but deadly in my opinion. It will be IMPOSSIBLE to have good numbers on that. And here's why....

Symlin is short acting and made to work with the short acting insulin in the mixed insulin. Therefore you need to cut that short acting down. Well, when you cut that down you cut the long acting down as well meaning you are going to go high hours later. There's no way to fix that.

You need to talk to your doctor about a true MDI regimen of one long acting insulin shot a day and multiple short acting shots of Humalog. Also, a type 1.5 is not initially insulin resistant.

I would talk to your doctor a little more.

[Cyborg]

Originally Posted by linda53

I started on Symlin last week. He started me on 10 units before each meal....I have been so nauseated and vomiting and want to know if this goes away after a while as it is really helping my PP readings actually so low I have cut my nightime insulin.

Your doctor should be following the manufacturer's recommendations. A type 1 typically starts at 2.5 units and when you get used to it without nausea, you add another 2.5 units. You repeat this until you reach the max. recommended dosage for a type 1, which is 10 units. The whole process may take weeks and you may never reach the max dosage.

I'm sorry, but your doctor is a quack, IMO...

[It Ain't Over]

Have been using Symlin with some real benefits for a year and a half. Took at least six months before the nausea faded. Had me on 10 units max at first, then a couple of months ago the endo asked me to increase up to 20 units.
I got all fouled up trying that and backed down to 10 again. I think I was using too much insulin and I went for a ride on the hypo roller coaster.
I will retrench and ebb up the Symlin, and reduce the insulin one small step at a time. Also noted that with that much Symlin I had a hard time feeling like eating, felt full at first bite. Nice to get rid of the hunger pangs, but that was hard to handle, as I would not eat enough and go low, them over eat and go up and then down... roller coaster.
Hope this adds something to the discussion. Since backing off have been off the ride for a week now. Nice.