[skilz123]

I start right now with the Novolog rolling, and will be taking my Lantus earlier starting tonight.

[HeatherP]

[skilz123]

Hoooray! I was 109 before dinner, took 3N (shook and shook that bottle) ate 50 grams of carbs and 2 hours later 130 Yes!!!!!! Who would've knew this could have solved things. I had almost the same type meal last night but 30 grams carbs took 2N and was 192 2 hours after, so this is actually working. Thanks for everyone's support and I had me a nice 20 gram carb snack just to celebrate!

[Shalyndria]

Agitating a clear insulin?! Now that's a new one! I'd be interested to see what Lilly/Novo would advise concerning that. Haven't ever had any problems with my NovoRapid personally, and I've never agitated it in the years I've been on it.

In any case, I'm glad to hear that it's working successfully for you, skilz ! Keep us posted on your progress!

A quick note of caution (in case your CDE missed it) is that you should never shake your insulin. Any excessive or overly forceful agitation can actually damage the molecules. Like Heather said, it's best to roll the vial gently.

Shy

[eevee]

Roll/shake Humalog..?? The only reason for rolling/shaking I should think would be to mix the insulin with the inhibitor---doubt that Humalog has much of that...it is rapid onset..!!
Carbohydrates could be your problem--lower them, lower your shots. You will really be surprised. Try shooting for pp of 150....
Cheers, Eve

[skilz123]

I'm not really shaking just rolling. My CDE seemed to think that rolling the Novolog was extremely important in getting it to work properly, and that if not it could be altering the actual amount I am taking and the amount of time it takes to react on my system. I really hope you guys are wrong and that rolling is what truly worked in last nights case, but I guess we will see. Maybe someone who takes Novolog can comment on this? Maybe it is just with Novolog? As for carbohydrates, I'm supposed to be eating like 60 grams at dinner so I'm not gonna lower those, I barely eat much carbs as is, maybe 90-120 a day.

[HeatherP]

I'm glad you're feeling and doing so much better Skilz!!!

I've always been told to roll all my insulin clear or not: Regular, NPH, Humalog and Lantus.

[Shalyndria]

Originally posted by skilz123
I'm not really shaking just rolling. My CDE seemed to think that rolling the Novolog was extremely important in getting it to work properly, and that if not it could be altering the actual amount I am taking and the amount of time it takes to react on my system. I really hope you guys are wrong and that rolling is what truly worked in last nights case, but I guess we will see. Maybe someone who takes Novolog can comment on this? Maybe it is just with Novolog? As for carbohydrates, I'm supposed to be eating like 60 grams at dinner so I'm not gonna lower those, I barely eat much carbs as is, maybe 90-120 a day.

skilz, maybe next time you see your CDE you could ask what the premis is behind rolling your Novolog? I'm really curious about this...

As I said, I use NovoRapid, which is the same thing as your Novolog. Outside of America Novolog is called NovoRapid.
Isn't this strange; I've only ever been told to roll my long-acting insulins such as NPH when I was on MDI's. I've never rolled my NovoRapid (Novolog) and before the advent of analogue insulins I was on Toronto (Novo's regular) and never agitated that either. And I've never had problems with fluctuations as a result of unevenly concentrated clear insulins, either. I do remember being told as a child that to minimize the pain of injections I could roll a vial of clear insulin to warm the contents slightly.

No matter how it turns out though, skilz, I hope that your current success continues!
Shy

[skilz123]

Well this mornings dose seemed to work the same, maybe I'm eating better, plus I did go for a 20 min walk which could be the reason why things worked better this morning, but for now I'll still believe it to be the rolling until I see otherwise. What my CDE told me was that if I am not rolling it the substance is not evenly mixed and therefore I could be only getting 1/3 or 2/3 what I am actually taking, or it could possibly slow down the onset. Logically I'm not sure why? But again she seemed pretty sure, and the way my numbers have been going so high and then dropping much later it makes sense about the slow onset. I will keep trying and we shall see.

[mariwood]

Here are my suggestions. First, follow the medical staff suggestions. Second, when you are trying to figure out a problem, draw a diet plan up for three days where all your meals are virtually the same in those three days. Keep the portions regulation size, space four hours apart, exercise the same amount the same time every one of those three days. This takes the wobble out of experimenting with your insulin. The results you get during three days of regulation diet will give a better overview of how the insulin is working without all the confusion of a varied diet. This has worked for me.
Third, I find that following the ADA diet and tweaking the carb counting to a lower level, I get better results with my insulin regimen than if I strictly follow a low carb diet. I don't know why this is, my insulin just works better when I balance my diet.
Fourth, try to learn the glycemic index principles. White flour, white rice, white pasta, no no. Waffles for example, would be challenging to test your insulin regimen. Try a breakfast of an egg, whole wheat toast with margarine or butter, orange juice, one or two breakfast sausages or a strip of bacon. This balances protein, carb, and fat. My mother-in-law ate the same breakfast for almost 84 years before she died. She was diabetic and she ate this breakfast every morning of her life. So she always had the same set point at the beginning of day with exception for sick days. She had the same insulin regimen too. However, she passed away years ago before Humulog or Novolog were available. So now we are lucky to have the ability to vary our diet and meal times and all that, but when you need to test your insulin regime, keep everything simple and conformed. The less variation in the diet, the clearer the picture of how your insulin works on you. I hope this helps.

[skilz123]

That is some amazing advice, thanks so much, I will definitly "try" to test some things that way. As for the rolling, unfortunatly that didn't last as last night I had the same meal as the night before and the rolling didn't work, but I think I figured out the real culprit and that was that I took my morning Lantus 2 hours later the morning it didn't work. So today I woke up at 9 AM to take my Lantus and just went back to sleep for a few hours. Hopefully this wil work and I am now taking my nighttime Lantus at 10 PM, I think this schedule will work, so please everyone keep your fingers crossed for me, and thank you all so much for your help.

[skilz123]

Well, the scheduling didn't seem to work either, obviously I may need some more results before I can be certain, but from the initial results even the timing of the Lantus is not helping dinner. What could this possible be, if I take the shot in my leg it sometimes works and other times it takes like4 hours to come down, (my legs have hardly any fat on them) and if I do the stomach sometimes it works but most of the time it comes down after 2 hours then shoots back up. Maye now that the Lantus timing is beeter I will go back to trying my stomach. Any ideas on this guys?

[Shalyndria]

You may just need to give it some time. I know that it's hard to be patient, but maybe that's all this needs to work out?

After re-reading your posts I have a few questions for you:
- do you have a correction factor, and if so do you do the math and bolus for hypo's and hyper's accordingly?
- how's your carb counting? Are you guessing CHO content when you eat or do you know for sure (based on say the nutritional content guide)?
- Do you keep a detailed log of what you've been eating and then look for trends based on what you eat in correlation to your ensuing BG's?
- Do you schedule your shots in specific sites; that meaning, is your morning Novolog always in your leg or stomach while your evening shot is always in the same spot?
- do you factor in the GI and/or fat content of what you're eating and how this is going to affect your post-prandial BG's?

Sorry for the 20 questions lol!
Shy

[skilz123]

No these questions are great but unfortunatly the answer to all of those are yes, I wish I didn't know what I was ding but unfortunatly being diabetic for 9 years I know way too much. Correction Factor Yes, Nutritional Guide sure do. Detailed Log you betcha, Morning always in stomach and evening was always in leg because stomach wasn't working (like I said I kept shooting up 3 hours after dinner if in the stomach) Lantus always in leg. Maybe I'm not 100% with GI and fat content, but seriously, when the same exact meal has different outcomes something is weird. I'm gonna try shooting dinner in my stomach a few minutes after completing my meal and see how that goes. For some reason I think that may help cause I take all my other shots pre meal there, not sure why it used to raise my later, but maybe that was a Lantus timing thing and since now my Lantus timing is better Just hoping, well, I'll let ya'll know later, off to dinner.

[eevee]

I'm supposed to be eating like 60 grams at dinner so I'm not gonna lower those, I barely eat much carbs as is, maybe 90-120 a day.

Wonder who says you have to eat that many carbs..?? The more carbs one eats, the more unpredictable one's bGs will be, and the harder to guesstimate the amount of rapid acting insulin required. Another little advertised fact about carbs is that they are what fuels 'cravings'. How often do we 'crave' a piece of steak compared with how often we 'crave' something sweet..??
I am not saying "go no-carb"..just that you shouldn't feel compelled to eat that many. Our brain reportedly needs only about 12g carb per day to function well--our heart prefers 'fat' as a fuel..!!
Personally I have about 60g carbs per day, having most at
breakfast and lunch, and try to have very few at evening meal. My bGs aren't wonderful (these days mostly in 80-150(4.4-8.3) range...heaps better than when I was 'told to eat' twice the amount.

..........Eve