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pumper

A Thread for Diabetic Weightlifters, Bodybuilders, Powerlifters & Fitness Lifters

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Scratch
Hi fellow lifters, I have a question, I have a small idea of what stabilizer muscles do, but could someone explain it in alittle detail for me and what are some techniques I could use to strengthen them up.

What you are hearing about stablizer muscles is probably referring to muscles not directly involved in moving a weight, but are used to maintain the body's stability. For example, if I'm doing a military press, the muscles used to move the weight are mostly the deltoids and triceps to get the arms extended above the head. At the same time however, if I'm doing that standing military press, my core needs to remain steady which requires muscles like the abs and lower back holding, along with the glutes keeping the hips locked, the quads and calves keeping the legs firm underneath you.

 

My own opinion is the best way to strengthen those muscles for the most part is to do lifts that use them to do that very act of stablization. I think there are situations and times to perform exercises that strengthen those muscles in an isolated fashion, but for the most part people can make more efficient use of their strength training time by using lifts which utilize compound movements.

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Evermont
...My own opinion is the best way to strengthen those muscles for the most part is to do lifts that use them to do that very act of stablization. I think there are situations and times to perform exercises that strengthen those muscles in an isolated fashion, but for the most part people can make more efficient use of their strength training time by using lifts which utilize compound movements.

 

I agree Scratch. If I knew someone was planning on taking up hiking but suffered from "weak ankles" where they have a tendency to roll them, I might suggest specific exercises to work the muscles on the inside and outside of the lower legs to help prevent ankle injuries for example. Boots with ankle support are a good idea too - but as an addition, not as a substitute for strong muscles. My lower legs are in better shape than a lot of folks, I think because I hike a lot. So I don't do any specific exercises for that. Hiking is best for me and I'd MUCH rather spend my time soaking in the views from the top rather than making some silly weight go up and down a lot.

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BrianSCohen

Keith,

 

Good point that you may need to work stabilizer muscles themselves. Doing the major lifts may just not be enough. I find I have had to work my rotator cuff muscles separately to strengthen my shoulders. Just doing the lifts simply caused strains rather than making the those muscles (and tendons) stronger.

 

If you have particular movements you are concerned about, we might be able to make some more specific suggestions.

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pumper

I have a bit of a strange question for all you diabetic bodybuilders out there, but since many bodybuilders shave their body hair, maybe it won't be such a strange question after all...

 

So, I've been on the insulin pump since December and I really like it.

 

But, since going on the pump, I've also lost weight-specifically belly fat. So, when I put in a new infusion set, I often hit a small vein or the muscle bed and then get bad insulin absorption. I still have a small bit of belly fat around my belly button, so, I've been putting the infusion set there (about an inch around the belly button) and will be switching to the shorter infusion sets (6 mm instead of 9 mm).

 

The problem is that I have a bit of hair on my abs so taking the old infusion set out can be really painful with the adhesive pulling on the hair.

 

So, I've been thinking of shaving my stomach to make it easier. My wife agrees that getting rid of that belly hair would make things easier - but she feels that waxing it off would be better (and easier in the long term) than shaving it.

 

A lot of you guys here are serious bodybuilders. Some of you must be shaving - what do you recommend? Shaving my abs every few days or waxing? And if waxing, which kit?

 

Have any of you guys run into this problem with sticky infusion sets and body hair?

 

This is all kind of ironic since I'm one of the least hairy guys out there...

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JadeMonkey

I shave my infusion and sensor sites just to make the whole process easier. Not only do I get much easier removals I also have far fewer problems with the sets and sensors not staying adhered firmly. This is especially true of the tegaderm I use to cover the sensors. Trying to get one to stay stuck on an unmaintained piece of real estate is next to impossible; with a little basic landscaping I don't have any issues.

 

I use a Fusion Power razor, haven't tried waxing.

 

-Jade

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George83

Listen to your wife, I wax my upper body, although I only went through pain the first few times, you get used to it after that, its much better as opposed to shaving, hair takes longer to grow back, but seriously the pain isnt that bad, I thought it would be worse.

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pumper
I shave my infusion and sensor sites just to make the whole process easier. Not only do I get much easier removals I also have far fewer problems with the sets and sensors not staying adhered firmly.

 

Since I started this thread, I figured that I'd post a final reply on what I decided to do.

 

So, based on Jade's posting (and other postings), I decided to give shaving a try. So, I used a razor in the shower under running water and shaved my abs. The first time was a bit of work - even though I not very hairy. But, I've been maintaining it with a quick shave every time I shave my face - and that seems to be working really well. I'm obviously too chicken to try waxing - despite it being suggested by my wife...

 

In terms of removing the infusion sets - which was the reason that I've started this - problem solved!

 

Will say that I felt really self conscious about this on the first few days - despite being a bodybuilder, but I got used to it. Now, I just need the 6 pack abs to justify shaving as a bodybuilder...

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pumper

Since this is a bodybuilding thread, I figured some of you would be interested in knowing that I ran into one of my favorite bodybuilders the other day, Arnold. He was in town for a Governor's conference and had stopped into a restaurant for a late lunch - which is where I saw him.

 

Very surprising that he's not that big of a man - neither very tall (about average hight) nor a very imposing presence. I was expecting a huge imposing man, which he isn't.

 

On his way into the black SUV, he turned back to the crowd that had gathered and have his signature: "I'll be back".

 

Kind of cool...

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pumper

Does anyone on this thread use bodybuilding supplements? and which ones?

 

In the next few days, I'm going to start taking a "home-made" creatine stack composed of the following (from supphead on the bodybuilding.com forums):

 

German Creatine Monohydrate -5g pre -2g post

Beta-Alanine -1.5g pre-1.5g post

Bcaa -5g pre-5g during-5g post

Arginine-AKG-3g pre-1.5-post

Glutamine-5g pre-5g post

Caffeine/Tyrosine tabs 200 to 300mg caffeine-250 to 375mg tyrosine pre

 

Any of you guys ever used any of these? and if so, did they work? Any other supplements that I should also be considering? What about blood sugar effects?

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Evermont
Does anyone on this thread use bodybuilding supplements? and which ones?

 

In the next few days, I'm going to start taking a "home-made" creatine stack composed of the following (from supphead on the bodybuilding.com forums):

 

German Creatine Monohydrate -5g pre -2g post

Beta-Alanine -1.5g pre-1.5g post

Bcaa -5g pre-5g during-5g post

Arginine-AKG-3g pre-1.5-post

Glutamine-5g pre-5g post

Caffeine/Tyrosine tabs 200 to 300mg caffeine-250 to 375mg tyrosine pre

 

Any of you guys ever used any of these? and if so, did they work? Any other supplements that I should also be considering? What about blood sugar effects?

 

I'm not into supplements generally. But recently I noticed that my lab results are showing a creatinine trend. I'll be asking my doctor soon what she thinks about supplementation to keep my numbers from falling below the bottom of the 'normal' window. I'm not even sure if this makes sense which is why I'll check with my doctor first, and do it based on actual blood test results.

 

My creatinine lab results:

0.90 11/2005 (when I had my laparascopic appendectomy)

0.84 08/2007 (just prior to Dx of T2, tweaked exercise & diet)

0.74 04/2008 (continued diet and exercise improvement)

 

The normal range is 0.70 to 1.50, so I'm trending out of bounds. I need to learn if supplementing is the right thing to do and if so, how much and what kind. If I get up closer to 1.50 with supplementation, can I expect to build muscle faster? I'm just not sure about all this yet.

 

Anyone considering supplemention should read up on the controversy and side effects like those listed here (link)

 

Controversy

 

While creatine's effectiveness in the treatment of many muscular, neuromuscular, and neuro-degenerative diseases is documented,[6] its utility as a performance-enhancing food supplement in sports has been questioned[7] (see creatine supplements for more information). Some have even proposed that its use as a performance enhancer should be banned.[8] [9] [10] Despite this, creatine remains very popular.[11]

 

Side effects

 

Short-term use of creatine in healthy individuals is generally considered safe (see Creatine supplements#Safety). Continuous intake of excessively high dosages of creatine may lead to any of several possible side effects. It has been hypothesized that consistently high doses could lead to hypertension due to increased water retention [12].

 

Creatine supplementation utilizing proper cycling and dosages, however, has not been linked with any adverse side effects beyond occasional dehydration due to increased muscular water uptake from the rest of the body.[13]

 

According to the opinion statement of the European Food Safety Authorities (EFSA) published in 2004 it was concluded that "The safety and bioavailability of the requested source of creatine, creatine monohydrate in foods for particular nutritional uses, is not a matter of concern provided that there is adequate control of the purity of this source of creatine (minimum 99.95%) with respect to dicyandiamide and dihydro-1,3,5-triazine derivatives, as well as heavy metal contamination. The EFSA Panel endorses the previous opinion of the SCF that high loading doses (20 gram / day) of creatine should be avoided. Provided high purity creatine monohydrate is used in foods for particular nutritional uses, the Panel considers that the consumption of doses of up to 3g/day of supplemental creatine, similar to the daily turnover rate of creatine, is unlikely to pose any risk".[14]

 

This opinion is corroborated by the fact that creatine is a natural component in mothers' milk and that creatine is absolutely necessary for brain development in the human embryo and the baby, as well as for optimal physiological functioning of the adult human body, especially the brain, nervous system, the muscles and other organs and cells of high energy expenditure, where the creatine kinase (CK) system is highly expressed and creatine levels are high.

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Evermont

I also found this interesting (from the same source)

"In humans, approximately half of stored creatine originates from food (mainly from fresh meat and fish). Since vegetables do not contain creatine, vegetarians clearly show lower levels of muscle creatine which, upon creatine supplementation, rise to a level higher than in meat-eaters"

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kstreeter513
I'm not into supplements generally. But recently I noticed that my lab results are showing a creatinine trend. I'll be asking my doctor soon what she thinks about supplementation to keep my numbers from falling below the bottom of the 'normal' window.

 

My creatinine lab results:

0.90 11/2005 (when I had my laparascopic appendectomy)

0.84 08/2007 (just prior to Dx of T2, tweaked exercise & diet)

0.74 04/2008 (continued diet and exercise improvement)

 

The normal range is 0.70 to 1.50, so I'm trending out of bounds. I need to learn if supplementing is the right thing to do and if so, how much and what kind. If I get up closer to 1.50 with supplementation, can I expect to build muscle faster?

 

Creatinine and Creatine are not the same thing. Low creatinine levels are a good thing and show that kidney fuction is normal. Creatinine is a waste product produced by your body and filtered out by your kidneys, high levels indicate kidney disease.

 

Creatine is something produced and stored in skeletal muscle to aid in ATP production.

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Evermont
Creatinine and Creatine are not the same thing. Low creatinine levels are a good thing and show that kidney fuction is normal. Creatinine is a waste product produced by your body and filtered out by your kidneys, high levels indicate kidney disease.

 

Creatine is something produced and stored in skeletal muscle to aid in ATP production.

 

Well that's why I was out to ask doc about it, I knew they weren't the same thing but I'm uncertain about the relationship. Lower is better for creatinine sounds good, given my numbers. But now I'm left to wonder, why is there a lower limit? What does it mean to be below that limit? What should I do about it? I mean if it were not a bad thing, why would there even be a low end of 0.70?

 

So I see that they are different things and lower is better for creatinine - but what about this statement: "vegetarians clearly show lower levels of muscle creatine which, upon creatine supplementation, rise to a level higher than in meat-eaters" ? Is this suggesting that I should consider creatine supplementation? How can I tell if it's indicated? Is "higher than meat-eaters" a good thing?

 

I need to study up - but if you folks can point me in the right direction - please do!

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Evermont
...I knew they weren't the same thing but I'm uncertain about the relationship....I need to study up - but if you folks can point me in the right direction - please do!

 

Again, like kstreeter513 said, creatine and creatinine are NOT the same thing.

 

Again, I know they're not the same thing. Repeating that answered NONE of my questions. But thanks.

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pumper
Again, I know they're not the same thing. Repeating that answered NONE of my questions. But thanks.

 

OK-my apologies. I mis-read your post as saying that you continue to confuse creatinine and creatine as the same thing - which upon re-reading you clearly now understand. My error.

 

It is true, however, that creatinine is the break-down product of creatine. However, oral ingestion of creatine will not necessarily increase your creatinine output - since the creatinine clearance test is often part of a ratio that looks at kidney function - so, if your kidneys are healthy, I wouldn't assume that creatine supplementation would alter your creatinine profile.

 

As for vegetarians having lower creatine levels - that is my understanding also. Some people feel (not certain if there is science to back this up) that heavy red meat eaters have naturally very high muscle creatine levels (since there is alot of creatine in red meat) and therefore can often not see much of a result from creatine supplementation. Vegetarians, on the other hand, have lower muscle creatine levels and therefore can respond very very well to creatine supplementation.

 

Hope that this answers your question.

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kmengers

Hi everyone. I am a recently diagnosed (April 21) type 1. I just got on the pump about a week ago. Before i was diagnosed I worked out all the time. I played tennis, ran track and loved to lift weights. I have worked out maybe ten times since being diagnosed. This has deffinately been the hardest challenge for me. I know there are different ways of doing this so if you've found something that works for you please let me know. I was thinking about eating without bolusing but then im worried ill go to high. the other thing i was thinking about was just suspending a couple hours before i work out. im still unsure if the only way to work out is to let ur bg get high? Im open to any suggestions regarding working out. Thanks so much.

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pumper
Hi everyone. I am a recently diagnosed (April 21) type 1. I just got on the pump about a week ago.

 

Welcome to the thread - and glad to hear that you are already on the pump - I think that that is a smart choice.

 

Before i was diagnosed I worked out all the time. I played tennis, ran track and loved to lift weights. I have worked out maybe ten times since being diagnosed. This has deffinately been the hardest challenge for me.

 

Good to hear that you are already used to lifting - I think that this will be more important than ever, now that you have diabetes. I really feel that lifting is one of the best types of exercise for people with diabetes, especially since lean muscle makes you more insulin sensitive and gives you better overall control over your blood sugars.

 

I know there are different ways of doing this so if you've found something that works for you please let me know. I was thinking about eating without bolusing but then im worried ill go to high. the other thing i was thinking about was just suspending a couple hours before i work out. im still unsure if the only way to work out is to let ur bg get high? Im open to any suggestions regarding working out.

 

Dude, I don't have a good answer - and you already seem to be thinking about this correctly (ie drop insulin or increase food for exercise). But here are my suggestions.

 

1) Initially, try to workout at the same time of day while doing the same types of workouts. For example, if you are lifting in the evening, try lifting only in the evening for a week or two and not doing any cardio or any other type of exercise at that time of day. This will let you find out how you respond to that type of exercise at that time of day. The issue is that different types of exercise will have a different effect on your blood sugars (both during and after the exercise). Also, the same exercise at different times of day will also have a different effect on your blood sugars.

 

2) Since you are lifting, I'm assuming that you might have some bodybuilding goals. So, I'd try to avoid eating extra to bring your blood sugars up for a workout - because that means extra calories. (Though, I would take extra carbs if you are about to start a workout and your blood sugar is below 100.) What I would do is to reduce your insulin - but you need to do that ahead of time. I'd suggest giving yourself a 50 % temp basal 1 hr prior to the start of the workout, during the workout and 1 hr after the workout. If you go low during the workout, then give yourself even less insulin (ie 25% basal 1 hr prior) and if you go high, then reduce the temp basal less (ie 75% basal 1 hr prior). That will give you the opportunity to learn how your body reacts to that type of exercise at that time of day.

 

For me, I have to give myself more of a reduction in temp basal (50%) for cardio and less of a reduction (70-80%) for lifting. If I lift in the morning (when most people are insulin resistant), then I have to give myself no reduction (ie no basal). So, expect different types of exercise to affect you differently - and also different based on the time of day. Yes, it gets complicated - but there is often a physiological reason for the differences.

 

I hope that other people will chime in with their experiences.

I'd suggest that you read (and post questions) in these other forums (in addition to here...) to learn as much as possible.

 

diabetes and bodybuilding - Diabetes Daily Forum

Any body builders out there?? - Diabetes Daily Forum

A Thread for people with Type I Diabetes (Insulin-dependent) Only - Page 7 - Bodybuilding.com Forums

 

Hope that this helps man - ask more questions if things don't make sense.

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andrews730

whats up? im new to this site and am loving what i am finding. I have been a diabetic since 5th grade and started working out when i graduated high school which was about four years ago. i am tryin to gain about 15 more pounds and am loving the information you guys are putting out there. I take 33 units of lantus in the morning and 1 unit to every 8 carbs of humalog when i eat. let me know if anybody has any questions and i'll definately do the same

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pumper
whats up? im new to this site and am loving what i am finding. I have been a diabetic since 5th grade and started working out when i graduated high school which was about four years ago. i am tryin to gain about 15 more pounds and am loving the information you guys are putting out there. I take 33 units of lantus in the morning and 1 unit to every 8 carbs of humalog when i eat. let me know if anybody has any questions and i'll definately do the same

 

Great to have you on board Andrew!!! Any advice that you can bring to this forum is always appreciated.

 

Keep on lifting buddy.

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andrews730

thanks. yea im about to go to the gym in a few and do some chest and arms and i'll drink a protein shake with several scoops of oatmeal in it for a post-workout shake to get me some good carbs in it. I will do my insulin to cover it and will try putting it in my triceps maybe just because they will be pumped from working them. I know someone said to inject in the muscle but others disagree and I don't know so I figured I would try it for myself for a little while cause I dont believe it could hurt me to try. And also since I am on a scale of about 1 - 10 or around there for my humalog, say if I have 60 carbs in my shake including my milk and oatmeal, if I should do 60 units of humalog or a little more? I know the 60 would take care of what I eat but does anyone have info if I should inject more in me to maybe shoot me a little low or is that stupid? haha...remember I'm trying to get bigger so just lemme know anything if you can thanks

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RikBrooks

I hope that this post isn't too long. I've worked out off and on my whole life. I turn 51 tomorrow. I've been having a hard time finding that magic combination that will work for me at this age but I'm making very slow but steady progress.

 

First of all for my bodybuilding I need a lot more rest time. Not just because I'm diabetic but also my age. I overtrain very easily. So now I train only one body part per workout. Mostly I do big compound exercises, 3 sets of 8-10. I take creatine but no protein powder. My exercises are designed so that the exercise of one muscle group doesn't affect the group that I'll be exercising tomorrow. For example, No triceps then chest the next day.

 

I do these exercises Tuesday, Wednesday, and Friday - the days that I don't do Muay Thai. On the same day I do a one hour walk/run. Right now I'm running for a minute and walking four, repeat until an hour is over.

 

On Monday and Thursdays I do an hour of Muay Thai. That's a great aerobic exercise but it's also a pretty good resistance exercise. Punching and kicking other people is hard work. It's also amazingly difficult to hold pads for someone that punches and kicks hard.

 

On Saturdays I work clearing land on my farm. That is by far my hardest workout. It entails cutting down trees with a chain saw then cutting off the branches and cutting the trees into two foot sections. Then I carry those over and pile them up for seasoning. Imagine doing standing rows for 12 hours straight. It's a workout.

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Pasaway

Hi Guys,

 

Sorry I'm off track here. I'm new to this forum and I just wanted to get your advised. I been starting to workout and lift some weights but also would like to start working on my abs. I'm afraid that once I develop muscle on my stomach is I got no where to inject my insulin. I use a pen to inject insulin 4 times a day on my stomach and was wondering where do you guys inject your insulin when you guys developed muscle???

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BrianSCohen
Hi Guys,

 

Sorry I'm off track here. I'm new to this forum and I just wanted to get your advised. I been starting to workout and lift some weights but also would like to start working on my abs. I'm afraid that once I develop muscle on my stomach is I got no where to inject my insulin. I use a pen to inject insulin 4 times a day on my stomach and was wondering where do you guys inject your insulin when you guys developed muscle???

 

Ok, first, you won't get washboard abs by working your abs, you get them by dropping your bodyfat. You will need to get to like 10%. I doubt I will ever get to that point.

 

Alrighty, now that you are in shape for your first bodybuilding contest, here are some suggestions from Dr. Bernstein. The man is in great shape (Secrets To Normal Blood Sugars-Painless Insulin Injection).

 

Good luck on those abs.

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