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cyberus

Whatever happened to YMMV?

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cyberus

Whatever happened to YMMV?

 

It used to be the dominate attitude but recently it seems there are more and more threads turning into "wars" over whose (insert subject here, diet or whatever) is more righteous. :(

 

As we (used to) all agree diabetes is almost as individual a condition as the people who have it, ways of dealing with it are also as individual as the lifestyles and metabolisms of those people. :cool:

 

YMMV, we need this in posts more, rather than people picking apart someone elses way of dealing. If someone takes a shot at your way of dealing it might be a good idea to take a breath, shrug and if you have to reply, reply with "Hey, it works for me, YMMV" and call it a day. :D

 

I would really hate to see new people show up and pass us by because one of the first threads they see is a pizzing contest that makes this place look like one of the sites we all love to hate because of their tunnel vision approach to the Big D. :(

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TommyC1

Amen to that brother.

One of the reasons I keep coming back here is that most folks seem to recognize that we are individuals not statistics.

 

Tommy

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Barberian

I can't agree more Cyberus. I try to avoid threads that are "pizzing" contests, or heated debates. I find there are more recently than when I joined DF. It's been slowly ramping up. Civility is a measure of the person, especially when there is a difference of view. I wish more people would try and take the high road. Just about all thread about health care and carbs degenerate into people trying to "prove" they are right, everyone who doesn't agree with them is an idiot. Diabetes is NOT the same for everyone. Type 1, Type 1.5, Type 2, Pre-diabetic, Insulin resistance, honeymooning, other health/heredity/medication/diet issues. Lets just agree YMMV (Your Milage May Vary) as Cyberus said people. Lets keep this site civil, and respect everyone who decides to visit or make DF thier home (Leave it up to the Mod's to decide if someone needs to be "uninvited". A PM to the mod's works wonders, if nothing else at least alerts them to the behavior).

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Dis-N-Dat

I don't know what the accronym YMMV is but I get your point.

 

You're right and I myself have been guilty of getting involved in some of those heated debates.

 

I hate it, because it justs alienates us and heaven knows there's enough of that in the world. I'm going to refuse any future urge to argue.

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cyberus
I don't know what the accronym YMMV is but I get your point.

 

You're right and I myself have been guilty of getting involved in some of those heated debates.

 

I hate it, because it justs alienates us and heaven knows there's enough of that in the world. I'm going to refuse any future urge to argue.

 

YMMV = your mileage may vary

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Granny Shanny

Thank you, Cyberus, for putting the cards on the table.

 

I have been guilty of participation myself, when a new arrival starts throwing their weight around & dictating all the things that are wrong with the ways the rest of us are managing our disorder (and I've been officially slapped down for it too). I think the time has come for people on BOTH sides of ALL the issues to exercise a little self-discipline and common civility.

 

Perhaps a wise moderator is watching who would be willing to make this YMMV thread a sticky.

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yannah

well, I agree, I won't demand to someone that my way is right.

 

(regarding carbs, diabetes ect...) I can only offer what has worked for me. make suggestions.

 

so I will continue to try and help and offer my story as to what has happened to me.

 

but I bow out when things get ugly. no point. people hopefuly will try, different things till it is working. thats what I hope.

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cyberus
Thank you, Cyberus, for putting the cards on the table.

 

I have been guilty of participation myself, when a new arrival starts throwing their weight around & dictating all the things that are wrong with the ways the rest of us are managing our disorder (and I've been officially slapped down for it too). I think the time has come for people on BOTH sides of ALL the issues to exercise a little self-discipline and common civility.

 

Perhaps a wise moderator is watching who would be willing to make this YMMV thread a sticky.

 

I'm just hoping that getting the "cards out on the table" might make people step back and take a look, things will settle down (IMHO) once that happens :)

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princesslinda

I agree wholeheartedly Cyberus! It does seem that more and more threads are going off track, emotions getting the better of us. While we all start off trying to EDUCATE, more often than not, I feel we ALIENATE.

 

When I came to the forum, I was scared, looking for answers....and I got so much more than that. I received warmth, support, encouragement, friendship along with the answers I sought.

 

New forum members may sometimes seem confrontational, but this is where we "senior" members need to have a little more patience. They are new, scared and finding their way. Some may be dealing with the effects of extremely high blood sugars, some may not be familiar with forum etiquette, and some may just be troublemakers. We can help them along, show them the way, w/o getting "on their level" if we'll temper our advice with kindness. Those who wish to "stir the pot" will go elsewhere if we take away their spoon.

 

None of us will ever agree about how to best manage diabetes. But we should be able to share advice in a positive way, keeping our feelings off our sleeves and just ignoring inflammatory posts...they lose their power that way.

 

YMMV is true in just about any part of life, not just in our diabetes. All we know is our personal experiences. We can quote studies all day long, but at the end of the day, we're all finding what works for us.

 

Let's make this forum a place where everyone, regardless of carb preferences;) , feels at home!

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foxl

people hopefuly will try, different things till it is working. thats what I hope.

 

 

Worth repeating!

 

I do however think people challenge low-carbers a lot -- not just here, but in the literature, in social situations, etc. So we are not just defensive, but reactionary -- and keep an armament of reasons handy for what we are doing.

 

So when we are told it is "okay" to eat x, y, or z ... and we know from our meters that does not work for us, and especially when we know how limited we ARE in what we can tolerate, and are told what we can tolerate is "BAD!" we react. And the cumulative effect of hearing this everywhere means, some innocent bystanders pop in to tell us how dangerous cheese is, or whatever, and they do get an earful. And if you have been here a while it seems the earful is repeated a lot. But ... so are the admonishments. SIGH. Sorry.

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notme
I agree wholeheartedly Cyberus! It does seem that more and more threads are going off track, emotions getting the better of us. While we all start off trying to EDUCATE, more often than not, I feel we ALIENATE.

 

When I came to the forum, I was scared, looking for answers....and I got so much more than that. I received warmth, support, encouragement, friendship along with the answers I sought.

 

New forum members may sometimes seem confrontational, but this is where we "senior" members need to have a little more patience. They are new, scared and finding their way. Some may be dealing with the effects of extremely high blood sugars, some may not be familiar with forum etiquette, and some may just be troublemakers. We can help them along, show them the way, w/o getting "on their level" if we'll temper our advice with kindness. Those who wish to "stir the pot" will go elsewhere if we take away their spoon.

 

None of us will ever agree about how to best manage diabetes. But we should be able to share advice in a positive way, keeping our feelings off our sleeves and just ignoring inflammatory posts...they lose their power that way.

 

YMMV is true in just about any part of life, not just in our diabetes. All we know is our personal experiences. We can quote studies all day long, but at the end of the day, we're all finding what works for us.

 

Let's make this forum a place where everyone, regardless of carb preferences;) , feels at home!

 

 

I don't need to add much to this as Linda has said it very nicely. I would love to see people make their point and then let others make theirs without being picked apart.

 

We are all different. This is a "Diabetes" forum, not a forum supporting one and only one way of thinking. YMMV applies to everyone.

 

Thank you for speaking up cyberus. I think it was overdo. :)

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foxl

I suspect some of the participants in the back-and-forth however have learned more from it, on both sides of the fence. I know I have!

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princesslinda
I suspect some of the participants in the back-and-forth however have learned more from it, on both sides of the fence. I know I have!

 

This may be true, but on the flip side, an equal number (especially newer members) may have been so intimidated by all the drama that they shy away from posting lest they have all of this turned on them.

 

No one wants to be made feel their opinion is less valid than that of another, and IMO that's what some of our threads do.

 

Nearly every post of this sort ends up being reported to the moderators, often more than once. Just because the posts aren't deleted doesn't mean they aren't upsetting to others.

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Granny Shanny
Worth repeating!

 

I do however think people challenge low-carbers a lot -- not just here, but in the literature, in social situations, etc. So we are not just defensive, but reactionary -- and keep an armament of reasons handy for what we are doing.

 

So when we are told it is "okay" to eat x, y, or z ... and we know from our meters that does not work for us, and especially when we know how limited we ARE in what we can tolerate, and are told what we can tolerate is "BAD!" we react. And the cumulative effect of hearing this everywhere means, some innocent bystanders pop in to tell us how dangerous cheese is, or whatever, and they do get an earful. And if you have been here a while it seems the earful is repeated a lot. But ... so are the admonishments. SIGH. Sorry.

 

Absolutely worth repeating. Especially the "SIGH". I think it would be good if a coupla new words are added to the "nanny program". When applied to others' methods of managing their diet, judgmental & inflammatory words like "bad" and "wrong" are at least as harmful to the harmony on this forum as a few of the words already being censored by "nanny".

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It Ain't Over

For one to come on here and start in, well it is almost as bad as those we have all heard from..' you shouldn't do that, you are a diabetic, you should eat that, you should drink that, don't do that, you need this or that....

We are not machines, we are people with a disease and none of us, not one, chose to take this one on.

But we have it and we need to find our own way through.

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Rekarb

I relatively new here but frankly I've found those threads very useful. A lot of things get clearly elucidated. It seems there were some misreadings but writings always seem to have that. I know you guys want to keep it "kind" but don't go so far that you start to censor yourselves. This is great info and it does involve our lives so some passion should be expected.

 

Mike

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howdysf

I think you're all wrong.. let's start a flame war over it!.. ha ha ha ha ;)

 

but for the record, I haven't noticed it any more recently than it ever was since I joined DF 2.5 years ago....

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Evermont
I think you're all wrong.. let's start a flame war over it!.. ha ha ha ha ;)

 

but for the record, I haven't noticed it any more recently than it ever was since I joined DF 2.5 years ago....

 

Look pal, I've heard just about enough out of you :mad:

 

Good one - ha. Seriously, same here. I figure I must have skipped enough threads to miss the rigid impoliteness.

 

YMMV comes in many flavors. I suspect that energy expenditure and fitness differences are part of what varies also genetic variations along with other causes that attenuate various hormones including not just insulin, but the hunger and satiety hormones too. Infections including but not limited to periodontal will vary from one person to another. Fruits can be more or less ripe, vegetables more or less cooked and in different ways. People don't all eat at the same speed. Digestive action varies. I could go on.

 

Anyone who thinks that our mileages don't vary is missing a lot. Effectively it is a practical impossibility to know enough so that a BG meter becomes truely useless. Oh, and meters and test strips vary too. ;)

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gingercake

I have to say that when I first came here, I was so grateful for all the information that I wasn't getting from my doctor - and still am. But I quickly went into lurk mode because it seemed like nearly so many threads devolved into a low-carb vs. not-low-carb debate (even if the original post wasn't even about that). I don't even know if "debate" captures it - it's like a holy war, sometimes!

 

I know from a decade or more of being online that's just kind of how it goes on the internet. It's not like regular in-person conversation. I do think we could use more YMMV instead of "if I ate that many carbs, my head would explode!" or "if I ate that much fat, my arteries would instantly freeze!" Hearing each and every individual experience has been so helpful for me...but things do sometimes take on a fundamentalist tone.

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reefedjib

I'll chime in. When I first joined a month or two ago, everone was very supportive in one form or another. As I posted my BG numbers of 350, I got some shock and some direct instructions to start low carbing. All good. Mixed results. In these threads about D, no one was ever antogonistic. There are differences of opinion about dieting, but these differences were expressed respectfully.

 

Now, there have been some threads on health care reform and such which did seem to get a bit heated at times, but I have purposely inserted myself into that debate. While I may have a difference of opinion with those I am debating, I have always tried to be civil about it and follow the precept YMMV. :)

 

All in all, this is a great forum with lots of caring people, and I don't mind the occasional disagreement. It keeps things interesting! Glad to be here!

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davef

Cyberus,

 

Well said and good on you for stepping up to the plate and saying.

 

I feel we have lost not only new people, but there are some old regulars MIA recently, I have come close to joining their ranks as I have grown tired of the pizzing contests.

 

I think yourself and Linda have said things very well. I guess I'm either getting too old or too tired for that shi-te.

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EeyoreButterfly

I can only think of one thread specifically that devolved somewhat, but got back on track. Apparently I have missed something. By the sounds of it there are issues with low carbing and health care reform threads? I tend to avoid those anyway.

 

I do agree that regardless of whether or not the thread stays on track the YMMV does seem to be slowly dying on this site. It's nice to be reminded.

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Grunch
I do however think people challenge low-carbers a lot -- not just here, but in the literature, in social situations, etc. So we are not just defensive, but reactionary

 

From what I see in this forum the general attitude of people who eat normal amounts of carbs is "if low carbing works for you, great", while many low carbers try to promote the idea that carbs are bad. It's very annoying having to read that over and over again.

 

Do you think many low carbers are like this because, lke you said, they are challenged in social situations and stuff? If so, they should know better than doing the exact same thing to people who do fine with carbs.

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