Jump to content
Diabetes forums
  • Welcome To Diabetes Forums!

    Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today to contribute and support the site.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

ColePit09

Dr Still Think I'm type 2?

Recommended Posts

ColePit09

I originally thought I might be type 2 diabetes as well, but when my symtoms occcurred all of a suddened without warning I got suspicious. Especially because of my age. The typical age for the start of T2 Diabetes is 40+, I was 25, and moderately overweight. My Dr. of course put me on Metformin, and other oral medications none of which did any good. I went a month before my doctor finally decided I should try insulin. Like magic my sugars dropped from being around 3-400 in the morning to around 150 (in a matter of days). I of course watch what I eat and count every carb that goes into to my mouth. I test frequently and I've been researching this disease thoroughly.

 

I feel my Doctor may not be the best for me. I had to fight for a C-peptide and GAD antibody to prove what type I was. I had suspected LADA or T 1.5 because of the similar stories I read on here and with some of my other family members who are already diagnosed with Type 1.5. They all (in my family) had the disease start around the same time mine did (25). My cousins's story was so identical to mine it was scary. That lead me to beleive ours weas hereditary because my grandmother had it too. So now I have this docotor who still believes I'm type 2, even though my C-peptide was normal (2.8) and my GAD (6.1) came back positive he believes I'm a T2 with "antibodies" patient. I'm concerned he only looks at me as an overweight fat black guy "oh he has T2 DB" kind of attitude. I'm tempted to start seing an endocardiologist to get more testing done.

 

Either way, I'm on insulin now MDI (Bolus) only for all my meals. I can't eat without it raising my BG 5 bazillon points? Obviously I have insulin resistance, but shouldn't my pancrease be putting out more insulin if it was working properly. I want answers...he doesn't seem to be giving them to me. What do you guys thing? Do you agree with him? How does he know my pancrease isn't being attacked and I'm losing the functionality day by day. Heck, maybe I caught it early and the reason I have a normal C-peptide is because my beta cells aren't dead yet. But the presence of the AB no matter the volume is troubling to me? Why isn't it to him? :mad:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ant hill

I would wait for the C peptide test to see what that would tell you but I see that your symptoms is not anywhere near a T1

Are you thirsty? Hungary? Loosing weight without trying. Going to the toilet too many times in your day. If you are not then you are a type 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Subby

This post is my opinion, and is not medical advice, etc. I say that because I am going to give some definite opinions, but I may certainly be very wrong.

 

DX sure seems to be a troublesome thing for some situations, that's for sure. The important thing is you found something that works: insulin. That and diet and weight loss should be your main aims regardless of what type you have in front of your name!

 

That said, a few comments on your arguments.

 

1. Age. Not overly relevant. They are finding T2s of all ages, from children up. They are finding T1s of all ages, from 70s down. You are one person, you have a good chance of not being the "norm".

 

2. C-peptide. I understand your argument that you "should" be overproducing if type 2, but I do not know how reliable overproduction is to prove T2. Do you? I do think that a normal c-peptide indicates your pancreas is certainly up to producing which suggests substantial lack of pancreas action is ruled out. I would say that the fact you have a normal C-peptide and need insulin on top, means that insulin resistance is a huge issue you have, whether it is technically T2 or not.

 

3. Insulin working, meds not working. T2 "antidiabetic" meds seem notorious for working in some, not working for others. I don't think that's a firm indication, either. Insulin use will work for everyone. That's not a firm indication, either.

 

I do think you are in a strong position to progress if you use the insulin wisely and do everything you can to reduce weight and insulin resistance factors. As far as I can see, everything points to insulin resistance being a primary issue for you. So even if you are not T2, it would make a great deal of sense to treat yourself like one with or without insulin, to lose weight and reduce as much pressure on your pancreas as possible, in ways people do on this forum.

 

And, I'd suggest if you are not happy with your doctor, see another one! (endocrinologist, that is).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ColePit09
I would wait for the C peptide test to see what that would tell you but I see that your symptoms is not anywhere near a T1

Are you thirsty? Hungary? Loosing weight without trying. Going to the toilet too many times in your day. If you are not then you are a type 2

 

I had all of those issues....I lost 30 Ibs in a month without trying and was eating fatty foods like wendy's. I did get the C-peptide it came back "normal". Even on the insulin therapy I'm still losing weight which is good. My symptoms have subsided now that my BG has gotten under control. If I'm am indeed T2 then this is good news, it means I can get better right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
xMenace
If I'm am indeed T2 then this is good news, it means I can get better right?

 

That of course is going to be a big debate until after we're all gone, but I believe so, if you do the right things. IMHO the right thing is to control your insulin levels. Keep them as small as possible while keeping your BGs normal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Subby
If I'm am indeed T2 then this is good news, it means I can get better right?

 

I'd be very careful of this assumption. What does getting better mean for you? There are plenty of people willing to sell you cure hopes on the internet. One commonly espoused idea that if you eat low carb you are basically going to be cured, or "the majority" are going to regain all health and halt all escalation of T2. I'd ask for backing beyond one or two anecdotal experiences and possibly spurious scientific claims. Of course, that in itself, can be one big spiders web to try and sort out.

 

Perhaps not surprisingly, those who catch their T2 early and have good and lasting results from dietary changes alone, are the loudest and most strident on speaking on behalf of easy resolution for all or most T2s. Could you be one of those people who can effect great health for a long time with just meds, dietary and lifestyle changes? Buggered if I know. And I'd beware of people who claim they know on your behalf via a few words on a forum.

 

You should get a variety of T2 responses at some stage, hopefully.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
jwags

Type 2's can be dx'd at any age, even as young teenagers. Many of us have low C Peptide and are not overweight. As said above one type of diabetes is not better than another it is just managed differently. Many Type 2's use insulin. The higher C Peptide score tells me your pancreas is still working, which is a good thing. It tells me that by losing weight, exercising, changing up your diet you may be able to limit medications and insulin at some point. But you will still be diabetic. Lots of Type 2 tends to run in families much more than Type 1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
VeeJay

If I were in your shoes, I'd seriously consider seeing an endocronologist. I am able to control BG without meds - at this point, but it's early in my diabetic journey. If I ever got to the point where I needed meds or insulin, I'd see an endro since they know so much more than any general MD does (usually).

 

My doc is in the dark ages about how to treat diabetes and isn't all that sold on a low carb diet. Since my numbers speak for themselves, she doesn't argue with me, but nor does she recommend the same for any of her diabetic patients. Sort of a one-size-fits-all approach with the expectation that all diabetics will eventually have complications. I will NOT allow this kind of attitude to become mine! I continue to see her because I need her prescription for insurance to cover testing strips, and I don't really need her for anything else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl

If you have antibodies, you have autoimmune activity. PERIOD.

 

Now ... your doc may be saying Type 2 = non-insulin-dependent (an older definition of Type 2)? Even the CDE in the Endo office told me, "There is NO SUCH THING as a Type 2, with antibodies! (treason against Endo #1!!!)

 

If you have autoimmune activity, insulin is helpful because it helps rest your pancreas and, as it were, keeps auto-antibody activity down. So you preserve some function, which is shown to prevent some of the later side effects of Diabetes.

 

I have had to fight this fight, too. You need not only an Endo, but one who is very current on the literature, and acknowledges your status as a LADA, and understands the treatment of it. You might have to do a bit of homework before choosing an Endo ... I ended up having to switch, to get someone knowledgeable. Good luck!

 

The other thing (besides the insulin) is that getting this dx saved me from feeling like a FAILURE for being unable to succeed on oral meds, diet, and exercise, only! Which is a big deal -- I have been trying to keep my carb intake down, and exercise, and yet my control has steadily degenerated, until I FINALLY got rapid insulin, in January. And my use of insulin has been gradual, instead of sudden, so my dose(s) are still quite low, and that minimizes hypos.

 

I do hope you can find an Endo who will work WITH you!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Subby
The other thing (besides the insulin) is that getting this dx saved me from feeling like a FAILURE for being unable to succeed on oral meds, diet, and exercise, only! Which is a big deal -- I have been trying to keep my carb intake down, and exercise, and yet my control has steadily degenerated, until I FINALLY got rapid insulin, in January.

 

But... isn't the failure thing a perception issue, and unfair for T2s who utilise insulin sensibly or inevitably, and a perception we shouldn't be encouraging in others? As in, if you were a T2 and still needed to go to insulin, why would that be a failure?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl
But... isn't the failure thing a perception issue, and unfair for T2s who utilise insulin sensibly or inevitably, and a perception we shouldn't be encouraging in others? As in, if you were a T2 and still needed to go to insulin, why would that be a failure?

 

Yes, it is. But ... IF I were "purely" a Type 2, I might have been able to control strictly by diet, exercise, and weight loss. Knowing that this would almost certainly not be the case has made it easier for me to accept insulin, instead of having a doc offer, and me accept a parade of oral medications which would not have been particularly effective ... and me falling apart as none of them worked -- up to 3 at a time!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Subby

I can understand that. I was about to say that the OP at least does already have insulin, but then saw only bolus. That seems a bit strange if the endo is stuck on T2 - can't see the method any which way. All up, I agree another endo definitely sounds advisable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl
I can understand that. I was about to say that the OP at least does already have insulin, but then saw only bolus. That seems a bit strange if the endo is stuck on T2 - can't see the method any which way. All up, I agree another endo definitely sounds advisable.

 

Well, insulin has been shown to hasten beta cell recovery in T2D, so that is a good thing. Although, whether this MD knows about that study or not is a different issue ... ;)

 

I got basal, first, just for DP -- I would probably have done better on bolus first.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Subby

What I meant was that T2s almost invariably seem to be started off on a basal or mix - whether truly ideal or not for them - so the actions of the doc seem inconsistent even within old school parameters. Just seems to be an indication of the doc flailing around, to me.

 

Whether one wants a consistent or inconsistent old school doc is probably a silly question ... a consistent up to date one would be better either way :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl

Yep!

 

But he may be calling it like he sees it, on using rapid first, too. Knocking the tops off the peaks may be enough at first .... and maybe he saw more of a problem post-meal?

 

I try to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am not sure WHY, anymore!

 

 

What I meant was that T2s almost invariably seem to be started off on a basal or mix - whether truly ideal or not for them - so the actions of the doc seem inconsistent even within old school parameters. Just seems to be an indication of the doc flailing around, to me.

 

Whether one wants a consistent or inconsistent old school doc is probably a silly question ... a consistent up to date one would be better either way :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
liz32
Yes, it is. But ... IF I were "purely" a Type 2, I might have been able to control strictly by diet, exercise, and weight loss. Knowing that this would almost certainly not be the case has made it easier for me to accept insulin, instead of having a doc offer, and me accept a parade of oral medications which would not have been particularly effective ... and me falling apart as none of them worked -- up to 3 at a time!

 

I'm purely T2 and I was put on insulin after 3 months because oral meds and extreme change in diet did nothing. My first a1c was over 16 and I was almost comatose. Why is there such an attitude in general and even here that somehow all T2's are overweight and did it to themselves or if they'd just eat right it'd all go away: or the other general attitude seems to be that you don't have "real" diabetes unless it's T1. Why is that? I must be missing something because if you're treating your diabetes with insulin what's the difference what the type? Doesn't the type just indicate cause... I know T1's have autoimmune which causes other issues besides that T2's don't have to deal with but my friend is T1 and I'm T2 and we deal/treat our diabetes the exact same way. Why is there this attitude that one type is more legit than the other? Forgive me if I've misunderstood something but I'm really confused!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl

Liz, my frame of reference for the whole thing is how physicians normally treat T2, and how they began to treat ME. I was dx the same way you were. The docs I saw assumed my problem was insulin resistance and put me on 3 oral meds ... and told me to eat 1800 kcal per day. The whole thing made no sense to me ... and if they had continued to treat me that way, I would likely have gotten insulin sooner than I did ...

 

I was obese, before DKA dropped my weight.

 

It is not just the stigma of Type 2 (which, indeed exists, I am well aware of THAT), it is how docs treat Type 2, oral meds and eat LOW FAT. So ... I could have gone along with a Type 2 diagnosis, followed their directions, or I could go low carb (as I DID), and I would still have failed on all of their miracle meds ... one after another ... as all the while, my beta cells dwindled.

 

And yes, we know of Type 2's here who HAVE succeeded, dramatically, by diet and exercise alone. This just proved to my MD's I was not going to be one of them.

 

Now, does that still seem to insult or illegitimize Type 2's? Because that sure is not my attitude or assumption. Not at all. And, I AM on the max dose of metformin!

 

I'm purely T2 and I was put on insulin after 3 months because oral meds and extreme change in diet did nothing. My first a1c was over 16 and I was almost comatose. Why is there such an attitude in general and even here that somehow all T2's are overweight and did it to themselves or if they'd just eat right it'd all go away: or the other general attitude seems to be that you don't have "real" diabetes unless it's T1. Why is that? I must be missing something because if you're treating your diabetes with insulin what's the difference what the type? Doesn't the type just indicate cause... I know T1's have autoimmune which causes other issues besides that T2's don't have to deal with but my friend is T1 and I'm T2 and we deal/treat our diabetes the exact same way. Why is there this attitude that one type is more legit than the other? Forgive me if I've misunderstood something but I'm really confused!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
liz32

I'm glad that you think that the stigma of T2 does exist... I was wondering for a while if I was just imagining it. But it seems like every new person who's diagnosed with T2 wants to be diagnosed with T1 to make it more legit. It seems like people are scared of being labeled T2 . Thanks for you explanation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl
I'm glad that you think that the stigma of T2 does exist... I was wondering for a while if I was just imagining it. But it seems like every new person who's diagnosed with T2 wants to be diagnosed with T1 to make it more legit. It seems like people are scared of being labeled T2 . Thanks for you explanation.

 

You are welcome, liz -- I do ahve a frined in medicine and work in a med school, I am acutely aware of their attitudes, from other than a p atient standpoint -- and it is NOT pretty.

 

To give you some more backstory, at age 44 I adopted my first child, and then adopted 2 more. I am committed to remaining as healthy as possible until they reach independence -- and 2 are now showing developmental delays. So my drive to preserve my beta cells is ... VITAL!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
VeeJay
It seems like people are scared of being labeled T2 . .

 

Well, count me out of THAT loupe. I'm happy to deal with what I have. I commend all T1s and insulin dependent T2s in the balancing act that they appear (from reading posts here) to have to go through to keep good control.

 

I have not noticed a stigma against T2. But, I don't talk much about my diabetes outside family and close friends. Mostly because most of the diabetics I know don't take their disease seriously. What I HAVE noticed, though, is that the general public doesn't distinguish between the types, if they even know there are differences. And they assume all diabetics take insulin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ColePit09

I agree with Linda. It's not that I don't want to be T2 or T1 heck I'd prefer not to have any diabetes. But when the doctor can't give me a good reason that I'm one over the other I'm concerned especially when my body is expressing antibodies (GAD-65) in high numbers. That concerns me, it's telling me that something else is going on. Regardless I'm on insulin therapy now so I guess this is a mute point. My numbers are steadily declining going into normal range. Today is the first normal day BG wise since dx's. Also, being T1 vs T2 can mean a heck of alot when it comes to fighting the insurance company for medical supplies etc. So it's not about about bashing T2...I would love to just be able to change my diet, exercise and take a few pills in the AM and be in control But saddly my body doesn't work that way I need insulin. Without it my BG spike to over 300 easily. I had half a cup of yogart and I went from 129 to 230...with 10 units of insulin added!!! I just want a clear logical dx.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
foxl

Cole, your D will actually settle down, over time, as your beta cells come back on line (some die, some just go dormant when your NG gets very high), and you will gain better control. Over about a 6 month period. This takes PATIENCE, no question!

 

And yes, I did not even bring up insurance and what gets covered -- one of the better things was finally getting more strips than I can use in a month!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
VeeJay
I just want a clear logical dx.

 

I hear you. I really think you should be seen by an endo who would have more knowledge of diabetes than your MD - and able to interpret tests better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
liz32

I understand about your insurance... i wouldn't want to be in the states with a health need. My insurance covers anything diabetic... I can have as many strips as I want, and if my insulin use increases the pharmacist just tells the insurer that I need it earlier from now on. I'm very thankful for my insurance. I get where you are coming from and being around for you kids ( I have 2 as well) is paramount!! Thankfully I now have a great gp too... don't go to an endo cuz the last one was a nut job. For now my gp and I handle it pretty well between us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.