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pghMikey

Couple of Questions

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pghMikey

1)I remember reading a post that Aggie made recently that said that "most people on here couldn't tolerate fruit". How so?? What I mean is, if I am prediabetic or type 2 and eat some strawberries of course my BG will go up. Will I experience symptoms though?? If so what symptoms will I experience? I don't currently have a blood sugar testing monitor so I don't know how much my Blood Sugar goes up when I eat fruit but I don't feel any different. Should I if I am prediabetic or diabetic??

 

2) If a person who has a history of diabetes in the family and is let's say a race that has a higher propensity to get type 2, is it almost automatic that the person will get it?? I mean, Dominique Wilkins - a star NBA player was an elite athlete. Once he retired he wasn't as active and wasn't eating as good for only a few years but since his father and uncle had type 2 - he was all of a sudden diagnosed over 10 years ago. Is that surprising?? If Dominique was still exercising all the time and eating well after his retirement would he have still gotten type 2??

 

Just curious if people can help me. Thx

 

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TX_Clint

1. Buy a meter and eat to your meter. You won't feel slightly elevated bg levels but it will be doing damage.

 

2. Yes/No and Maybe. This is a chicken and egg thing. I'm of the following that it's genetics first and then the diet and exercise which just compounds things. Diet and exercise isn't the cause. If it was many of us here wouldn't be diabetic.

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princesslinda

You can't always trust how you "feel" as a way to measure your blood sugars.  That's why having a meter is so important. I'd urge you to get a generic meter at Walmart, as they and their strips are quite reasonable.

 

As far as the odds of someone getting diabetes if they have a strong family history, you just never know.  My mom, her mom, her dad and her brother were all T2 diabetics.  I am T2 diabetic, but my sister is not (she is larger than me and doesn't eat very healthy at all).  It does seem to run in families, so if you do have a strong family history, it would be good to keep an eye on your weight and overall health, just so you'll know when/if anything changes. We have several members who were a normal weight and quite health-conscious when diagnosed.

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Kit

1)  By can't tolerate we mean that out BG goes up higher than we would like it to go.  Blood sugar can get quite high without any noticeable symptoms, long after damage is being slowly done.  The only sure way to know is to test with a blood glucose meter.  Guessing by how you feel just won't cut it.

 

2)  My maternal grandmother had diabetes.  of her 8 children, 6 of them also became diabetic and 2 did not.

One of the ones who did not (one of my aunts) always tended to be heavy set and was the least active of the bunch (who she described as hyperactive famine victims).

My mother (the other one who has not become diabetic) has three children.  Two of us are diabetic and the third is very nervous.

 

Personally I suspect that genetics does play a big factor (though likely not the only factor).  I also suspect that diet and exercise alone won't keep it from happening, but only delay it.  The goal would be to delay it until after you are dead from extreme old age.  :)

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jwags

Type 2 is not caused by eating the wrong foods or not exercising enough. I was a vegetarian who worked out 2-3 hours every day. I was in the top range of normal weight for my size, but it was all muscle. I wore a size 8. I got Diabetes and I asked the same questions. What did I do to give myself diabetes? Then I realized that the healthy diet that dieticians tell you to eat is not healthy if you are prone to diabetes. I am now 115 pounds and still work out, but I can only eat very small portions of berries, 1/4 cup or I will spike. I cannot eat oranges, bannanas, melon, mango, peaches,etc.

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Stl-T2

Many people on here try hard to keep their blood sugar levels below 140 mg/dl, so when Aggie says they "can't tolerate fruit", I'm fairly sure she means they can't tolerate it without their blood sugar spiking above that level.  You may very well not know if your blood sugar is exceeding that threshold.  At some point, usually a bit higher than 140 mg/dl, the first symptom you might feel is increased thirst which then often is followed by increased urinary frequency.  It is very common for people to become full blown diabetics without realizing it for years.  However, just because you don't feel anything right away doesn't mean damage isn't being done.  

 

The answer to the second question isn't really fully known.  Genetics is a factor in type 2 diabetes, but there are a lot of genes involved in glucose metabolism.  There are fat people who don't ever develop type 2 despite eating poorly, there are skinny vegans with no family history that do develop it.  Maybe think of it as rolling a die.  With a fair die you have equal odds of getting each number.  With a family history it's kind of like rolling a die that isn't fair, and is more likely to come up D.  

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pghMikey

Yeah I should go out and get a meter - it's important. I don't know if you guys remember my post from about a year ago but I was diagnosed with prediabetes, went and worked out hard and changed my eating habits. I lost about 15-18 pounds and my fasting BG levels went from 108 to 79 or something. I was so proud of myself. 

 

HOWEVER - as the holidays approached last year I started getting lazy. I stopped working out from 5-6 days a week to 2 days a week to NO DAYS A WEEK. My eating also slowly went back to my old habits. Anyways, at my best I was around 185 pounds(I am 5 ft 7) but I weighed my self about a month ago and I was 205. 

 

So, 23 days ago I started again, bought healthy foods, eliminated almost all candy and junk and fried foods from my diet. I also started back again on the treadmill. Currently I do 65 minutes 5 days a week on a 6.5% incline and a 3.8 speed(fast walk) and I burn 650 calories. In 23 days I have lost 7 pounds but still have a long way to go. 

 

I'll be honest, once I relapsed I was eating so so much bad food and not exercising that I am worried I might have gotten type 2. I get that scared in those 6 months of eating bad. I have always had to pee a lot but I am not thirsty at all. All I drink is water. Like if I pee, I can literally go 30 seconds later and just a little more will come out. Is that a major symptom for type 2 because like I said, I am not thirsty at all. I am 40 years old.

 

Sigh... I am stressed. Any thoughts about my concerns?

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Kit

Go get a meter.  You will drive yourself nuts trying to guess.

 

The ReliOn Prime at Walmart was around $18 last time I looked and strips are $9 for a container of 50.

I just order mine online (since I really despise my local Walmart).

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jwags

There really is no cure or reversal for Diabetes. As you found out if you are diligent about diet and exercise your numbers go down, but as soon as you go off yiur diet or stop exercising your numbers go up. Fructose whichnis in fruit doesn't always spike you right away but it has to be processed in the liver, making insulin resistance worse. I was dx'd with a fasting of 242 and I had no symptoms at all. My eye doctor saw early eye damage and sent me for labs..

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pghMikey

In what you guys have learned, read, heard, studied etc... for type 2's does frequent urination USUALLY also go with increased thirst as a symptom? I mean, is it kind of unusual to have frequent urination but no thirst issues at all??

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Aggie

OK, first of all, yes, I meant that many diabetics cannot eat fruit without their blood sugar spiking too high.  However, if you are going to eat fruit, go ahead and have some strawberries (or blueberries, blackberries, raspberries..) because their sugar content is very low compared to other fruits. Just don't have huge amounts.  And test to make sure they are OK for you.

 

pghMikey, I am struggling mightily to understand why you just don't go buy a meter and test, rather than obsessing about thirst or no thirst or how you feel if you have high blood sugar.  Is it because you are afraid to see the results?  Even if you have higher blood glucose now due to your lapse in diet/exercise, you can REGAIN your previous lower values if you start eating lower carb now and doing more exercise.  That's what makes diabetes different from a lot of chronic diseases.  You have quite a lot of control.  Can you 'cure' your pre diabetes/ diabetes?  No, but you can control it and keep it from harming you.

 

But you can't do that unless you know where you stand.  When I was first diagnosed pre diabetic, I bought a meter and couldn't bring myself to use it for five weeks due to my anxiety, but it was no big deal and it is super helpful in identifying which foods are safe and which are not.

 

Go get the meter.

 

Regarding genetics, I think that genetics are extremely important in type 2.  There may also have to be some sort of environmental trigger, so it might be 'epigenetics' which are important.  Epigenetics has to do with which genes are switched on or off.  My paternal grandmother was diabetic, and 8 of her 9 children including my father.  Now several of my cousins have it.  My brother and I are pre diabetic, and my other brother has his head in the sand and won't get tested (I think his fasting is marginally OK).  Some of the diabetics in my family were overweight, but none were obese and many are just a normal weight.  I am 5 foot 5 and 135 pounds, and 51 years old.

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Ela

1) Usually there are no symptoms for the high BG but it doesn't mean they are not damaging.  Think of it this way - cancer usually has no symptoms either ...till it's too late.

 

2) I have absolutely NO HISTORY of diabetes in my family.  So???

 

And yeah, get a meter instead of driving yourself crazy and worrying sick.  Oh and I didn't have any thirst of frequent urination when my BG were in 300th.  No "diabetes symptoms" except for frequent skin infections, UTIs and other things that COULD have been totally diabetes unrelated.  But diabetes strikes you at your weakest spot.  For some it's eyes, for others it's kidneys, heart, urinary tract - the list goes on.  Diabetes is silent but relentless.

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Halves&pieces

 

I'll be honest, once I relapsed I was eating so so much bad food and not exercising that I am worried I might have gotten type 2. I get that scared in those 6 months of eating bad. I have always had to pee a lot but I am not thirsty at all. All I drink is water. Like if I pee, I can literally go 30 seconds later and just a little more will come out. Is that a major symptom for type 2 because like I said, I am not thirsty at all. I am 40 years old.

 

Sigh... I am stressed. Any thoughts about my concerns?

Hi, my thoughts and advice as a non-medical person regarding the peeing is to schedule an appointment with a urologist. I don't think the symptoms of T2 include not being able to empty your bladder completely, but I could be wrong.

 

Another early symptom of T2 is diminished visual focus. It can happen slowly and a person might not notice it, maybe shrug it off, until they do a simple eye chart test. It happened to me.

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pghMikey

You guys are all correct - I need to get a meter. I guess there is a part of me that is scared to see the results since I basically pigged out on bad food for 6+ months and didn't exercise. 

 

Just curious though, it's been over 3 weeks since I am back to eating much better and exercising. So if I test myself it really won't be that accurate since I have been doing diet and exercise right? I kinda wish I tested myself 24 days ago right before I started my program so I would really know what those 6+ months did to me.

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Ela

Start testing now and DO NOT STOP.  What's done is done and you can't change that. 

 

The thing with the testing regularly is it's so rewarding when you are behaving and seeing good numbers!  It IS for me!  It's like I'm having a constant contest with myself, lol.  My current goal is to keep my BGs below 100 all the time.  It only happens like 30-40% of the time, but it's an incentive to eat right and exercise. 

 

And then when I'm not behaving it's also very useful to test - once I see some ungodly number, the offensive food loses it's attractiveness. 

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miketurco

You can get an a1c meter at Walmart for $30. A1c is (mostly) a three month average of your blood glucose. Read up a little on the subject, do that test and see where you stand with that.

 

And, yes, get a meter.

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samuraiguy

1) Eating a ton of fruit all the time, probably not tolerable for most diabetics. Eating one serving of 1/2 cup of fruit along with a protein or healthy fat may make it very tolerable so use your meter to see if YOU tolerate it.

 

2) My genetics includes Native American blood and in particular Lakota tribal affiliation a group that has the highest per capita rate of type 2 diabetes in the US--something I wished I knew when I was a morbidly obese, inactive carb junky. That doesn't mean you will become diabetic because even though the general population is 8% type 2 the Lakota are still only 16% type 2 meaning 84% don't become diabetic. I do notice that my only active aunt==still farms in her mid 70's--is not type 2 where as my father and all his other siblings are/were type 2.  I look at this circumstance as a gun pointed at you, genetics points the gun at you, but lifestyle loads the bullets and pulls the trigger. Often just age is required to trigger type 2 and is probably why over 60% of newly Dx'd are over the age of 50. If you want to assess your overall genetic risk list how many primary and secondary relatives have type 2, I have 8 :P .

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funkynassau

Have you bought that meter yet?  If not, do it today!  I understand the whole anxiety/fear thing, but you need to know where you stand  Fretting about what you should have done 3 weeks ago is a waste of time, you can't go back.  Test a few times a day, write down the numbers, see how various foods react with you.  I can eat berries, tho not too many at one time.  I lust for other fruits, but dont eat them...

 

Both of my parents and at least one aunt had t2 diabetes, and so do I.  You can do a lot to help yourself and you need to get on it now and not wait any longer!

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fjordscape

Frequent urination alone is very unlikely to be caused by hyperglycemia, certainly not at prediabetic levels.

 

It is almost guaranteed that a person does not progress from excellent BG (like 79 while fasting) to diabetes in just 6 months.

 

If you are a middle aged male, middle aged men commonly (25% to 33%) develop urination disturbances: more frequent; reduced flow; there's a dribble after you zip up; you often wake up to pee, maybe even more than once during the night. There are a couple of others. It's under LUTS (lower urinary tract symptoms).

 

In the last year, I have almost gotten rid of years of LUTS by a minimal set of exercises for the pelvic floor muscles, prescribed during about 10 visits to a physical therapist. In youth, I peed, I suppose, 2 to 3 times daily. Then it increased to about 5. In 2013, this worsened to 8 or more. Now it's back down to 3 to 4. Also since age 44, I haven't been able to void quite 100%, there'd be an annoying posturination dribble, just one little spurt, but that's too much. This too, has mostly been remedied by the pelvic floor exercises.

 

Frequent urination in both men and women is often diagnosed as "interstitial cystitis". I myself received that diagnosis. I found out that some doctors are not convinced there is such a disease. It is a "diagnosis by elimination", resorted to when all other possible known causes seem to have been ruled out. I don't believe in interstitial cystitis; there is no positive test for it, nor is there a proven pathological anatomical sign.

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pghMikey

Frequent urination alone is very unlikely to be caused by hyperglycemia, certainly not at prediabetic levels.

 

It is almost guaranteed that a person does not progress from excellent BG (like 79 while fasting) to diabetes in just 6 months.

 

If you are a middle aged male, middle aged men commonly (25% to 33%) develop urination disturbances: more frequent; reduced flow; there's a dribble after you zip up; you often wake up to pee, maybe even more than once during the night. There are a couple of others. It's under LUTS (lower urinary tract symptoms).

 

In the last year, I have almost gotten rid of years of LUTS by a minimal set of exercises for the pelvic floor muscles, prescribed during about 10 visits to a physical therapist. In youth, I peed, I suppose, 2 to 3 times daily. Then it increased to about 5. In 2013, this worsened to 8 or more. Now it's back down to 3 to 4. Also since age 44, I haven't been able to void quite 100%, there'd be an annoying posturination dribble, just one little spurt, but that's too much. This too, has mostly been remedied by the pelvic floor exercises.

 

Frequent urination in both men and women is often diagnosed as "interstitial cystitis". I myself received that diagnosis. I found out that some doctors are not convinced there is such a disease. It is a "diagnosis by elimination", resorted to when all other possible known causes seem to have been ruled out. I don't believe in interstitial cystitis; there is no positive test for it, nor is there a proven pathological anatomical sign.

Wow thank you for the info on the frequent urination issue. Makes me feel better because after totally relapsing on my diet and exercise for 6-7 months, I was getting scared I had progressed into full-blown type 2.

 

Still haven't bought the meter and strips yet but I will be doing so by the end of the week. I feel like I have been making good progress on my diet and exercise program, although on Saturday night I had a bad cheat night. I went to this Italian pizza place and ended up eating 2, 10" wood fire pizzas(just tomatoes, buffalo mozzarella). Then I topped it off with 8 small fried sugar coated balls with nutella in the middle. I exercised that day though but still, the whole meal was probably in excess of 3000 calories. Pretty disappointed in myself, although on most other days I am eating between 1200-1600 calories. I do 4 consecutive days on the treadmill then skip a day, then back to 4 more days, etc... I warm up for 5 1/2 minutes at a very slow speed 1.2, then go to a 3.5% incline and 3.0 speed for another 5 1/2 minutes and then I do 49 minutes at 7.5% incline at 3.8 speed. Then I cool off for the last 5 minutes. It says I burn 686 calories in 65 minutes so hopefully that's good. Is it good anyone? I try to do crunchies every day and chest and shoulder and arms twice a week. I have only been doing this again for 27 days. It's hard but I am wondering if I set my whole program back by eating that outrageous meal on Saturday. When I got back I became so tired and was literally knocked out 90 minutes after the meal. 

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fjordscape

Wow thank you for the info on the frequent urination issue. Makes me feel better because after totally relapsing on my diet and exercise for 6-7 months, I was getting scared I had progressed into full-blown type 2.

 

 

Another factor for you to consider, regarding the frequent urination, is the overweight (205 lb on 5'7" yields a very high BMI). Whenever an overweight or obese person has a chronic ailment, it's a good guess the fat either causes the ailment or exacerbates it. Next, try to verify this hunch online. 

 

Until now, I never thought about abdominal fat maybe influencing LUTS, but the search engine turns up some confirmation. One writer says, "the excess weight carried around a person's middle puts undue stress on the muscles of the pelvic floor". And this page is incisive: http://www.pelvicfloorfirst.org.au/pages/how-can-i-tellif-i-have-a-pelvic-floor-problem.html 

 

From what you report, you do a lot more of both cardio and agility training than I do. Now to lose the weight. The main idea is to go low carb. Books on the Atkins or paleo diets can give specific food tips. A broad tip: when eating grain products, eat only whole grain (like brown rice). 

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pghMikey

Another factor for you to consider, regarding the frequent urination, is the overweight (205 lb on 5'7" yields a very high BMI). Whenever an overweight or obese person has a chronic ailment, it's a good guess the fat either causes the ailment or exacerbates it. Next, try to verify this hunch online. 

 

Until now, I never thought about abdominal fat maybe influencing LUTS, but the search engine turns up some confirmation. One writer says, "the excess weight carried around a person's middle puts undue stress on the muscles of the pelvic floor". And this page is incisive: http://www.pelvicfloorfirst.org.au/pages/how-can-i-tellif-i-have-a-pelvic-floor-problem.html 

 

From what you report, you do a lot more of both cardio and agility training than I do. Now to lose the weight. The main idea is to go low carb. Books on the Atkins or paleo diets can give specific food tips. A broad tip: when eating grain products, eat only whole grain (like brown rice). 

You might be right about the excess weight. My urination has been really frustrating for me. I literally can pee and then stand there and every 5 seconds a little more will come out. Sometimes after 10 minutes I really really have to go and my urine is mostly clear. Other times it's a normal yellow. The more I think about it I do think it is maybe an enlarged prostate or maybe Chronic Nonbacterial Prostatitis. I have Crohn's disease by the way just so you know. I am not on any medications for like 15 years since I had surgery but I do get flare ups from time to time.

 

As for my weight, definitely trying to lose it - have lost 7 pounds or so in 27 days but still when I look in the mirror I look fat. I don't "feel" like I am losing much weight. I took my blood pressure at a CVS the other day and the 2 readings were 118/78 and 108/65.

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princesslinda

Your "cheat meal" will likely set you back a bit.  I find if I slip up and eat a lot more carbs than usual, it takes a few days to get back to my typical numbers.  I know this because I have my meter with me at all times, and if i'm going to eat something that I know is problematic (ie: too carby), then I make sure to check my blood sugars so I see just how much that meal affects me.  If I don't test, it can be easy to pretend that it didn't do very much damage to my blood sugars.  Also, when I eat more carbs, I pee more often as my blood sugar is quite high.

 

The only way you're going to get control of your blood sugars and your health is to get a meter and test regularly.  As long as you have no way to test, you're keeping yourself in the dark.  Whether you are pre-D or type 2 (and there are those who feel that preD is actually just early onset type 2) is simply a label, and the treatment for either of them is very similar, reducing carbs and keeping watch on your blood sugars and maintaining a healthy weight.

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fjordscape

The more I think about it I do think it is maybe an enlarged prostate or maybe Chronic Nonbacterial Prostatitis. [. . .]  I took my blood pressure at a CVS the other day and the 2 readings were 118/78 and 108/65.

 

Systolic under 110 is excellent! Everything I read about various diseases (CVD, high blood glucose, kidney) concurs that keeping systolic pressure low is a key element of treatment, and of prevention too. 

 

I am really skeptical of enlarged prostate because your age, just having crossed the threshold of middle age. It would be a statistical fluke if you had an enlarged prostate before 50. 

 

The impact of excess body fat varies a lot with the individual. An often cited fact is that most obese people never become diabetic. But overweight correlates with so many ailments that I figure that it must hurt a person somehow, even if it doesn't give them a heart attack. It causes mechanical problems, like knee strain. 

 

A few years ago, I suspected I might have prostate problems. In my experience, it's not helpful to believe in that possibility. I certainly don't believe in ignoring trouble and hoping it will go away. "Prostatitis" is hard to prove, and it's also resistant to treatment. Medicine just usually has little to offer when it comes to prostate. That's why I think it's the practical approach to maintain other aspects of health, specifically, tone the abs and the pelvic floor, do cardio, and monitor the five parameters of "the metabolic syndrome" (look it up). Certainly, medicine really has no effective treatment for *noninfectious* prostatitis. If you were to lose 30 lbs and keep it off, and still have urinary symptoms, at least doctors might have more to go on, now that a few possibilities have been eliminated. In the end, it turned out I definitely don't have prostate problems. 

 

To test for prostate *enlargement*, you can get PSA measured. If the level is, say, 2 to 4, I think that's inconclusive as to whether there's enlargement, and how big a problem it is. If it's under maybe 2, but definitely if it's under 1, there's definitely no enlargement. 

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