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bigbrain

Is Diabetes reversible...

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meyery2k

I think Dr. Atria mentions being insulin resistant and having a metabolic disorder.

 

Vegetables are my savior. I can eat a lot of them, they keep me full, and are nutritious. With all the cheeses, cream, butter, and spices, the dieters by no means boring.

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Jefferson F. Araujo
On 11/06/2017 at 10:15 PM, Dave_KC said:

There are some reports that claim the ability to reverse diabetes, but it's very, very far from established, and while all of us would love that to be true, at this point we should live as though diabetes itself can't be reversed.  

 

But as others have pointed out, blood glucose can be controlled, and the consequences of out of control diabetes can be delayed or eliminated.  My motivation is that I have smaller children at home and I want to be there for them, along with my wife whom I love dearly.  

 

I was diagnosed last November with an A1c of 12.6, and the day I got the call (before I even saw the doctor about the diagnosis), I immediately started low carb, having a salad at Chick-Fil-A (and majorly disappointing my wife who wanted the chicken sandwich).  I was put on Metformin and Januvia and took my diet radically serious, along with continued exercise.  I went down to 7.4 in February and this may I got to 5.0 on the A1c...  my nurse practitioner said she put 16 exclamations after the number, and my Doctor's wife on Facebook described me as her husband's "poster child" for how to handle diabetes.  

 

At the same time, I've got news that a dear friend of the family who didn't take care of his diabetes has lost his leg, has terrible heart function, and now hospice has been called in, and he didn't take care of his diabetes, and we're seeing the results.  

 

So, I don't know if it can be reversed or not (although the practice I go to did mention that word at my last appointment), but even if I was truly reversed, I think I'd be insane to change diet and go back to eating as I once did.  

 

Seriously, there's good folks here who are glad to help and encourage you along the way, and get this under control.  

 

BTW, on low carb, I saw my other numbers in cholesterol and triglycerides get dramatically better, and mine weren't bad to begin with.

 

Your story partly looks like mine.
I also love my family, I have a 12 year old son. My wish is to live to go on your graduation from university.

I can not die now, I need a little more time.

My family is my biggest incentive.

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Dave_KC
1 hour ago, Jefferson F. Araujo said:

 

Your story partly looks like mine.
I also love my family, I have a 12 year old son. My wish is to live to go on your graduation from university.

I can not die now, I need a little more time.

My family is my biggest incentive.

 

Family is a great incentive.  My girls are 10 and 7 so I'm planning on being there for them as well.  Obviously we can't control everything, and all of life, but I'm doing what is within my power to keep myself around. 

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Hammer

No, diabetes can not be reversed.  When I see ads claiming that diabetes can be reversed, I want to kick those people in the butt who put out that ad.

 

Diabetes is a metabolic disorder, and there is nothing that can reverse that.  The people here all know that, with a low carb diet, exercise, and if need be, meds, their diabetes can be controlled.  Doing these things can get your A1C to drop down to normal levels....those levels that a non-diabetic has, but rest assured that if you were to stop eating that low carb diet, your glucose levels would shoot up.  All a diabetic can do is to control their diabetes, and by that I mean, it can be controlled, but it can't be reversed....those are two different things.  If you do what's necessary to control your diabetes, then the odds of you suffering from complications drops considerably.  That's all we can do....control it, and hope that we haven't caused our bodies too much damage to it before we got our diabetes under control.

 

I will say that you came to the right place to find answers in dealing with your diabetes.  These forums have many knowledgeable people who can offer you advice, based on their own experiences in dealing with their diabetes.  Everything I know about diabetes, I learned here.  If you have questions, feel free to ask them....that's what this forum is here for. :)

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Dave_KC
16 hours ago, Hammer said:

No, diabetes can not be reversed.  When I see ads claiming that diabetes can be reversed, I want to kick those people in the butt who put out that ad.

 

There are legitimate reports by some suggesting it can be reversed, but there are also ads out there which are simply touting a product that is a waste of time and money.  

 

What is clear at this point is that anyone diagnosed with diabetes needs to treat it like it's done for life, and that it's not going away.  

 

My prior appointment, my doctor mentioned the possibility of reversal.  She didn't guarantee it or make any promises, but she mentioned the word, so I'm not sure it's as absolute blanket "no way" as reported above.  

 

If it is possible, we're on the very early edge of research to answer the question.

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Mikael26288

In this area they use the Glucose Tolerance Test  to diagnose a person with Diabetes.

You can't cheat, like you can on an A1C test. 

But most people would be diagnosed as a diabetic if their A1C was tested in Jan. after Halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas. LOL

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Dave_KC
3 hours ago, Mikael26288 said:

In this area they use the Glucose Tolerance Test  to diagnose a person with Diabetes.

You can't cheat, like you can on an A1C test. 

But most people would be diagnosed as a diabetic if their A1C was tested in Jan. after Halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas. LOL

 

How does one cheat on an A1c test?  

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meyery2k

I asked my doctor about having diabetes removed from the chart because I am no longer on any medication and my A1C had been in the 4's consistently.

 

He says it doesn't come off the chart.  The best outcome is to have the comment of very well controlled or in remission because the belief is that, even though it is asymptomatic, you are still diabetic.

 

Based on my own observation, I have to agree because when I eat foods that will spike me, I go right over 140.  It is my understanding that non-diabetics do not do this.

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Dave_KC
6 minutes ago, meyery2k said:

I asked my doctor about having diabetes removed from the chart because I am no longer on any medication and my A1C had been in the 4's consistently.

 

He says it doesn't come off the chart.  The best outcome is to have the comment of very well controlled or in remission because the belief is that, even though it is asymptomatic, you are still diabetic.

 

Based on my own observation, I have to agree because when I eat foods that will spike me, I go right over 140.  It is my understanding that non-diabetics do not do this.

 

I didn't ask, but at my last appointment, the Nurse Practitioner volunteered that the diagnosis won't come off, but the meds did go away.  I too have noticed if I do blow it on diet, the numbers will spike...  like munching too much popcorn at the movie, when I jumped to 150.  

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Mikael26288
On ‎8‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 0:23 PM, Dave_KC said:

 

How does one cheat on an A1c test?  

Eat very few carbs for 3 months before the test. I have been able to make mine go down, doing that.

But when I don't expect the test, they usually get a more realistic result. LOL

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TX_Clint

I expect a test every 3 months. So, LCHF is just my lifestyle WOE now. It works better than anything.

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Dave_KC
53 minutes ago, Mikael26288 said:

Eat very few carbs for 3 months before the test. I have been able to make mine go down, doing that.

But when I don't expect the test, they usually get a more realistic result. LOL

 

Like @TX_Clint, I'd call that a lifestyle choice.  So, apparently I've cheated for the last nine months and got my A1c down to 4.7.  

 

Seriously, that's called a lifestyle choice, whether I'm getting my A1c tested for not.  I know that it's the best long term indicator of how I'd doing, so I'm willing to "cheat" if that means continuing to live and push off as far as possible the complications of diabetes. 

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slotking

As stated before, various causes to it.

one may be a fatty liver.  Cleans the liver and you may get off meds.

 

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Hammer

I think the problem with answering the question, "Is Diabetes reversible?", is that it depends on what is meant by reversible.  If you mean that, can you reverse your A1C from a high number, down to a non-diabetic number, then yes, you reversed your A1C levels, which could be taken to mean that you reversed your diabetes.  If, by reversible, you mean that, can you reverse diabetes so that you are no longer diabetic, then that answer is no.  There is nothing that you can do to go from being diabetic, to being non-diabetic.  Sure, you can have bariatric surgery done, and that usually results in a person falling into the non-diabetic category, but if they go back to eating a high carb diet, they can eventually end up with high A1C levels, which would put them back in the diabetic category.

 

From articles that I've read, what seems to happen when an extremely overweight person undergoes bariatric surgery, is they can only eat small quantities of food.  But as time goes on, the person will begin to eat a little more food and that stretches their stomach.  The fact that they were originally extremely overweight, meant that they ate too much food, so they go back to their old habits of trying to eat more and more food.  Over time, their stomach will eventually get back to the size it was before the surgery, so any benefit from the surgery is lost.

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Healthynut

I soooo wish it were reversible.  "Reversed" to me would mean I could go out and eat a donut and drink a Coke without my BG going above 120.  That will never happen unless and until a real cure is found.

 

I have normalized my BG without drugs, and yesterday my doctor actually told me I'm "cured." He's a very good doctor, but he's wrong.  Yes, I have BG readings that stay below 100 now, but I still can't eat a donut or drink a Coke.

 

If you stay on a ketogenic diet, or maybe a near-ketogenic diet, you may be able to fool your doctor too.  But if you are diabetic, you will never be able to eat donuts, pizza, french fries, or other "goodies" without risking your health.

 

Read all you can about low-carb living; read the posts on this forum; and put what you learn into action.  There is no short-cut.  There is no escape clause. You either do what is necessary (by low-carb living) to stabilize the progression of this disease, or you should plan on a slow, inexorable slide of deteriorating health.

 

Don't be afraid of eating eggs, bacon (without added sugar), sausage (filler-free so it has no carbs), steaks and steak fat, and other things the medical establishment and the ADA tell you not to eat.  If you stay on a low-carb (and necessarily high-protein, high-fat) diet, your blood screen numbers will speak for themselves.  Most of us saw our cholesterol and triglycerides plummet after going low-carb.

 

I've been on this diet (I eat eggs, cheese, fatty meats, and butter with one small salad of romaine lettuce, grape tomatoes, and broccoli each day) for two years, and yesterday I had an ultrasound of my carotid arteries.  My doc said they're as clear as a 20-year-old's.

 

Although I still miss Moravian sugar cake at Christmas, life's not so bad. At least I can eat all the turkey and roast beef I want.

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Healthynut

Bigbrain said: <<Does this mean that people who don't have the gene(s) can eat as much sugar, carbs, whatever they want till the cows come home every day and they will never get it. Doesn't seem logical. If anybody eats enough sugar then by definition their' bg will increase and by definition their A1C will increase.>>

 

I don't think there's a single gene that simply says "yes" or "no."  For a multitude of reasons (many of which involve genetics), some people process carbohydrates better than others.  Some people seem to be able to eat a lot of carbs their whole lives without manifesting health problems -- just as some people smoke all their lives but don't get lung cancer.

 

Just my personal hypothesis, but I believe we all have an internal clock.  Every time you eat a gram of carbohydrate, the clock's second hand moves a little.  One person's clock may run much slower or faster than others, but as a clock's hands move past a certain point, metabolic issues manifest themselves.  They manifest themselves as excess fat, as an array of mysterious health issues, in the form of cardiovascular disease or cancers, or as diabetes -- or as a combination of those things.

 

I am convinced I could have gone my entire life without becoming diabetic if I had known in my youth what I know now.  I grew up drinking soft drinks.  A lot of soft drinks.  An average of about 1 liter per day of Coca-Cola for roughly 50 years.  I ate pastries and donuts, french fries, bread, pasta, and rice to my heart's content.  I made it to 54 before I was diagnosed with Type 2.  I am convinced that if I had merely moderated my carb intake, I could have made it to 90 without diabetes.

 

Maybe I'm wrong.  We'll never know for sure, but I'm warning my children and trying to teach them to moderate their carb intake for life.

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Hammer

Healthynut, I view it a bit differently.  I think that we all have a carb threshold, and that threshold is different for each of us.....some have a high threshold, and some have a low threshold.  If we exceed that threshold on a constant basis, then we are more susceptible to developing diabetes.  The reason I view it this way is from what I've heard other members here commenting about.  I've heard them say things like, they can eat 1/4 of an apple, and it doesn't raise their BG levels, but if they eat 1/2 of an apple, their BG levels rise dramatically.  Their carb threshold would be the amount of carbs in that 1/4 on an apple.  Once they exceed that threshold, either their pancreas can't produce enough insulin to take care of those extra carbs, or their blood cell's insulin resistance increases, or a combination of both.

 

All a carb threshold means is that, if you exceed that carb threshold, then your glucose levels increase beyond a point that your body can handle.  If you have a low carb threshold and exceed that threshold on a constant basis, then that means that your pancreas is working overtime, trying to produce enough insulin to overcome your insulin resistance.  By working overtime all the time, your pancreas eventually begins to wear out, and once that happens, it can't produce enough insulin to overcome your insulin resistance.

 

Of course, there is no way that this can be proven, since something like this would take a huge number of patients, and a large amount of time, but it all seems to fit.

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Healthynut

Hammer, I see your point.  Maybe I should modify my paradigm to say that the clock moves only after the carb threshold of tolerance (which is different for each person) is surpassed.  And there is no hard and fast point on the clock when damage manifests itself; it does so gradually and insidiously as the clock moves forward.  That damage manifests itself differently for different people.  Some people simply store the excess carbs as fat and never become diabetic.  Other people stay thin but the damage manifests itself through the worn-out pancreas.

 

But I wonder too whether one can develop diabetes without repeatedly surpassing the carb threshold.  That is, I wonder whether I have a set amount of insulin that my pancreas can produce over a lifetime (and it produces insulin at the first gram of carb).  Or maybe the quantity it can produce declines with age even without abusing the threshold.

 

Or maybe my clock model works for some people, while for others the declining production model applies. Maybe one day we'll all know the answers.

 

 

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Fraser

Diabetes is not just a problem of not producing enough insulin, but also the in ability of ones body up to effectively use the insulin ( insulin resistance)" 

personally I make insulin,  by test, but it is just not used properly.  

I do strictly control my carbs, t is just a simple equation, I only consume carbs at the rate my body can consume them.  On the gene theories I am one four siblings, grew up the same ate fresh food from the garden, we were all active.  Ate Heathy diets .  I am the only diabetic, 

the only other extended member of my family that was a T2 was my father's father.  My grand father, father and I are the only one with blue eyes Straight hair.  Two out of the three were diabetic. 

No one else.     For what it is.  ) my last sugary drink was 35 years ago.  Oh well.

iidont really dwell on why, just how to keep things under control.

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pattycolombia

Sad to say diabetes run in both sides of my family; Mother side Grandmother, aunts (T1 with a very late diagnosis), uncles, mom and me.  Father side grand mother.

Between really annoying to see an ad in the forum  right now in my language - spanish that says "The end of diabetes - new solution for diabetes, enter before site is close"

 

Edited by pattycolombia
misspelling

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Dave_KC

I don't think the forum site controls the ads, and they base the ads on who buys them and what's "appropriate" for the site.  I've seen my phone company advertised, others, all kinds of products, musical instruments, diabetes meters, you name it.  

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